ground schools canceled

[TFTMB heavy]

Not completely accurate. MOst lease contract provide a PoA under certain conditions which is then utilized to lay the claim.

https://www.lexology.com/library/detail ... 141caab8dc

Hi Rudder, not sure the relevance but the lease may provide a power of attorney or similar in order to maintain the lessors rights. You can, essentially, claim and freeze an aircraft in location at which point the parties lawyers make final determinations.

Sounds like of the aircraft were deregistered quite quickly that an application to TC for reregistration and proof of default was provided to seize those aircraft.

[Maurice]

Why did the seized aircraft thread get deleted?

[capt_Z]

When an operation loses 4 aircraft unexpectedly, I would assume most people can figure out that some planned ground schools would have to be canceled. Hiring will continue until April 3rd. After that we expect ground schools to begin again in early 2024.

Hiring till 3rd April means fresh new interviews or just wrapping up the interviews already done?

Is there a last GS for 2023 scheduled for 3rd April? Or everyone will be kept in pool untill next year?

[the_new_guy]

When an operation loses 4 aircraft unexpectedly, I would assume most people can figure out that some planned ground schools would have to be canceled. Hiring will continue until April 3rd. After that we expect ground schools to begin again in early 2024.

Hiring till 3rd April means fresh new interviews or just wrapping up the interviews already done?

Is there a last GS for 2023 scheduled for 3rd April? Or everyone will be kept in pool untill next year?

There is a ground school in April, then for obvious reasons the hiring will be put on hold for awhile till the planned growth resumes. Anyone not able to attend in April (or not selected at this time) will be in the pool so that the company can resume hiring as soon as the need is there.

At this time we're operating close to our full schedule, but having rolled in 3 tails that were planned for the summer means we don't have the planned capacity at this time for the months to come. The company is actively working on solutions to bring aircraft into the fleet and reworking the schedule to stretch the current fleet's capacity a little, but until we add more planes, there's only a certain need pilot wise that will be filled after the April groundschool.

Hope this helps.

[nohojob]

When an operation loses 4 aircraft unexpectedly, I would assume most people can figure out that some planned ground schools would have to be canceled. Hiring will continue until April 3rd. After that we expect ground schools to begin again in early 2024.


Any pilot awarded and upgrades will still be given the opportunity, although there aren't really many that were qualified that hadn't already been upgraded. FO's continue to enjoy one of the best-starting pay in the industry currently, and like I previously said, even if growth under this contract remained stagnant, FO's wouldn't be affected as year 1-3 pay remains competitive. By that time we'll be into a new CBA and can address year 4 onwards.

Although growth has slowed for 2023, which will allow us to actually catch up on a few flight ops projects, Flair will continue to grow 2024 and beyond and provide career pilot jobs in the Canadian industry.

I understand but why inviting people for an interview in April if planning to hire in 2024 ?

[the_new_guy]

When an operation loses 4 aircraft unexpectedly, I would assume most people can figure out that some planned ground schools would have to be canceled. Hiring will continue until April 3rd. After that we expect ground schools to begin again in early 2024.


Any pilot awarded and upgrades will still be given the opportunity, although there aren't really many that were qualified that hadn't already been upgraded. FO's continue to enjoy one of the best-starting pay in the industry currently, and like I previously said, even if growth under this contract remained stagnant, FO's wouldn't be affected as year 1-3 pay remains competitive. By that time we'll be into a new CBA and can address year 4 onwards.

Although growth has slowed for 2023, which will allow us to actually catch up on a few flight ops projects, Flair will continue to grow 2024 and beyond and provide career pilot jobs in the Canadian industry.

I understand but why inviting people for an interview in April if planning to hire in 2024 ?

I don't know that hiring will only resume in 2024. That is the official position the company has taken, but that being said, you have to look at how fast things are going.

Within a few months you could see movement that right now is not priority nor foreseen, and that could be a few more planes to recover parts of the original scheduled growth. Or not. I'm not saying I know it will happen, I'm merely suggesting it could.

[tbaylx]

When an operation loses 4 aircraft unexpectedly, I would assume most people can figure out that some planned ground schools would have to be canceled. Hiring will continue until April 3rd. After that we expect ground schools to begin again in early 2024.


Any pilot awarded and upgrades will still be given the opportunity, although there aren't really many that were qualified that hadn't already been upgraded. FO's continue to enjoy one of the best-starting pay in the industry currently, and like I previously said, even if growth under this contract remained stagnant, FO's wouldn't be affected as year 1-3 pay remains competitive. By that time we'll be into a new CBA and can address year 4 onwards.

Although growth has slowed for 2023, which will allow us to actually catch up on a few flight ops projects, Flair will continue to grow 2024 and beyond and provide career pilot jobs in the Canadian industry.

I understand but why inviting people for an interview in April if planning to hire in 2024 ?

The planned ground schools won't continue after April 3rd. We will likely run some ad-hoc groundschools throughout the year due to attrition or additional aircraft later in the year.

[Tbayer2021]

I’m curious why four repos would cancel groundschools until 2024.

The average airline runs 6 crew per tail (12 pilots), which is only 48 pilots. For a company which is trying to recruit 20 a month, this would be a blip in the road and hiring would start again this summer.

Me thinks they finally woke up and need to slow roll the rest of the expansion as the piggy bank is depleted as airborne has proven.

Sage advice would say to give more importance to actions over words. The company has a difficult situation to manage on multiple fronts. They're certainly not going to say anything that may trigger an exodus of pilots. Not only will this make running their schedule more difficult, it will also place further strain on their clearly stretched financial resources, by cutting revenue and increasing training cost.

So pay close attention to the reassuring words from management while at the same time they pause hiring for about a year.

Caveat emptor

[Big Pistons Forever]

The way Porter and others are hiring, I would suggest that they will be soon be very short of crews even to fly a reduced schedule. Most of the pilots must be looking for other opportunities……

In any case anyone who signs a bond at Flair now is crazy.

[the_new_guy]

The way Porter and others are hiring, I would suggest that they will be soon be very short of crews even to fly a reduced schedule. Most of the pilots must be looking for other opportunities……

In any case anyone who signs a bond at Flair now is crazy.

Love your enthusiasm, but there are no bonds at flair.

[Schlomo Overpeck]

Although recent events are unfortunate, the atmosphere is quite positive and I have seen no signs of flight crew looking for an exit. Of course there are always some just passing though, however most of us are here because we want to stay and are giving the operation a chance.

[co-joe]

Why did the seized aircraft thread get deleted?

Because we don't need 6 threads on the same topic? It's getting hard to follow the avcan version of the story here.

[tbaylx]

The way Porter and others are hiring, I would suggest that they will be soon be very short of crews even to fly a reduced schedule. Most of the pilots must be looking for other opportunities……

In any case anyone who signs a bond at Flair now is crazy.

Unless you firmly believe Flair's demise is imminent there isn't really any good reason to leave Flair for Porter. I don't believe we'll see many pilots make that jump, although I could always be surprised.

[MAX8 Driver]

I think the largest concern was that anyone on credit/in debt was going to come forward and call upon said debt during a portion of peak travel season (after the repo), We must have had an injection of cash, and we survived that busy portion...thus status quo.

No need to make any lateral jumps as of yet, in my opinion. That said, with well over 60+ Flair applicants to Porter, it would be naive to think our pilots are not concerned. I think those who have applied elsewhere, the majority will jump ship to alternatives. Hiring/interviewing for Flair, IMO will likely continue beyond April for 2023, given the current market.

My opinion.

[Tbayer2021]

I think the largest concern was that anyone on credit/in debt was going to come forward and call upon said debt during a portion of peak travel season (after the repo), We must have had an injection of cash, and we survived that busy portion...thus status quo.

No need to make any lateral jumps as of yet, in my opinion. That said, with well over 60+ Flair applicants to Porter, it would be naive to think our pilots are not concerned. I think those who have applied elsewhere, the majority will jump ship to alternatives. Hiring/interviewing for Flair, IMO will likely continue beyond April for 2023, given the current market.

My opinion.

I'll be the first one to say that tbaylx and his lackie co-joe will be trying yo spin any attrition hiring, as things being back to normal and expansion resuming.

[capt_Z]

Are they still giving out GS invites or contacting candidates done with interviews? or letting them know if they are in a pool or something? or just silence?

[highspeed]

The email screenshot posted earlier was the last correspondence form the recruitment team. After that it's been crickets.

[MAX8 Driver]

I think the largest concern was that anyone on credit/in debt was going to come forward and call upon said debt during a portion of peak travel season (after the repo), We must have had an injection of cash, and we survived that busy portion...thus status quo.

No need to make any lateral jumps as of yet, in my opinion. That said, with well over 60+ Flair applicants to Porter, it would be naive to think our pilots are not concerned. I think those who have applied elsewhere, the majority will jump ship to alternatives. Hiring/interviewing for Flair, IMO will likely continue beyond April for 2023, given the current market.

My opinion.

I'll be the first one to say that tbaylx and his lackie co-joe will be trying yo spin any attrition hiring, as things being back to normal and expansion resuming.

Give it a rest. Hiring and attrition will literally come out in the wash. The majority are staying put, but there will be a continuation of hiring. Carry on.

[cdnavater]

I think the largest concern was that anyone on credit/in debt was going to come forward and call upon said debt during a portion of peak travel season (after the repo), We must have had an injection of cash, and we survived that busy portion...thus status quo.

No need to make any lateral jumps as of yet, in my opinion. That said, with well over 60+ Flair applicants to Porter, it would be naive to think our pilots are not concerned. I think those who have applied elsewhere, the majority will jump ship to alternatives. Hiring/interviewing for Flair, IMO will likely continue beyond April for 2023, given the current market.

My opinion.

I'll be the first one to say that tbaylx and his lackie co-joe will be trying yo spin any attrition hiring, as things being back to normal and expansion resuming.

Give it a rest. Hiring and attrition will literally come out in the wash. The majority are staying put, but there will be a continuation of hiring. Carry on.

Did tbaylx say or not say that April 3 ground school will be the last until 2024, therefore one could surmise that any hiring after April 3 is due to attrition?

[tbaylx]

I'll be the first one to say that tbaylx and his lackie co-joe will be trying yo spin any attrition hiring, as things being back to normal and expansion resuming.

Give it a rest. Hiring and attrition will literally come out in the wash. The majority are staying put, but there will be a continuation of hiring. Carry on.

Did tbaylx say or not say that April 3 ground school will be the last until 2024, therefore one could surmise that any hiring after April 3 is due to attrition?

Any hiring after Apr 3rd will be due to attrition unless aircraft come in the fall. That seems obvious if we aren’t getting any more aircraft this year other than the 5 we’ve already planned for.

Latest bid that just went out provided 15 more Captain upgrades