Ten year deal

[RippleRock]

No one ever said that you shouldn't make similar improvements from top to bottom. No one, not one person. Somebody had to take the bull by the horns and cudo's to the WJ pilots for taking it as far as they did. We ALL want AC to make significant gains,

Are you an AC pilot? You don't sound like it. Who in their right mind would be happy at the bottom of the "renumeration pile"? If you're not one of us, negotiate your own deal. "Me to" someone else.

[RippleRock]

I'm on board, I have already depleted my savings since starting here so if I have to wait another year on flat pay for negotiations to start I will need to look for another better paying job.

You knew what flat pay was before you joined AC. From management's perspective, why would they even consider getting rid of flat pay (as stupid as it is)? There's no shortage of applicants, from all facets, eager to get into the next ground school.

It's already been mentioned but just get you up to speed, the applicants are accepting the pay because the majority know there will be significant changes in the upcoming contract and people are wanting to secure seniority now in anticipation of this.

Of course I'm being sarcastic when I say, "Some pilots aren't that smart, and want to work here for substandard wages anyways...." Apparently there are a few management "wanna-be's" that think this way on this thread. But I find it hard to believe they are that stupid. They're likely just trying to stir the pot.

[RippleRock]

GONE.

Good riddance. 10 years of NOTHING for 10 years of labor certainty. What a lopsided deal. We gave a whole lot of that 2% nonsense back during Covid with -ZERO- gain from that either. Thanks ACPA, even when we had nothing to give, you gave another 30%.

Get ready for a very interesting summer, VO premiums just plummeted by half.

[Montroyal]

I don’t know. I don’t work for them.

And we wouldn't have them on speed dial if we weren't ALPA

[Bede]

Fact is, there is a growing & worsening pilot shortage. There are simply not enough pilots to meet demand. Jazz is shrinking. Mainline is upgauging with rumours of more widebodies

Either industry ponies up or they lose market share to people simply not traveling & US competition

It's a bit more complicated. There's a shortage of qualified pilots who are willing to work on smaller aircraft for less money.

Don't count on the pilot shortage helping you in negotiations. (It will help Jazz and Encore though.) The only thing that will help you is your unity and supporting your MEC. That's how the US gets their gains. You vote in the right people, you walk in lock-step when they ask for a strike mandate and you trust them when they say that they've got the best deal they can get.

[Jimmy_Hoffa]

Fact is, there is a growing & worsening pilot shortage. There are simply not enough pilots to meet demand. Jazz is shrinking. Mainline is upgauging with rumours of more widebodies

Either industry ponies up or they lose market share to people simply not traveling & US competition

It's a bit more complicated. There's a shortage of qualified pilots who are willing to work on smaller aircraft for less money.

Don't count on the pilot shortage helping you in negotiations. (It will help Jazz and Encore though.) The only thing that will help you is your unity and supporting your MEC. That's how the US gets their gains. You vote in the right people, you walk in lock-step when they ask for a strike mandate and you trust them when they say that they've got the best deal they can get.
[/

It is indeed complicated, however… Is your new AIP not good enough to to retain jr WJ pilots? What about flow from encore? Not good enough to attract them either? The number of new hires at AC from the “Alberta Partnership” is not insignificant and if they stop applying it has a direct impact. Given the ambitious expansion plans touted by WJ and AC we are still competing for the same limited pool of “qualified” pilots. The question is how much AC is willing to spend to attract those individuals. It’s their business and above my pay grade. The rest of you statements about pilot unity will help move the goal posts past the company’s minimum threshold. As soon as AC starts paying more than WJ again what happens to your pool of experienced candidates then?..The numbers of licences being issued by TC doesn’t exactly support a glut of labour either…

-Jimmy

[Ash Ketchum]

I'm on board, I have already depleted my savings since starting here so if I have to wait another year on flat pay for negotiations to start I will need to look for another better paying job.

You knew what flat pay was before you joined AC. From management's perspective, why would they even consider getting rid of flat pay (as stupid as it is)? There's no shortage of applicants, from all facets, eager to get into the next ground school.

It's already been mentioned but just get you up to speed, the applicants are accepting the pay because the majority know there will be significant changes in the upcoming contract and people are wanting to secure seniority now in anticipation of this.

Exactly, that and the quick upgrades. Although it seems the upgrades won't be so quick anymore for new hires so better be one hell of a contract.

[cjp]

Who knows, just read Air Canada organized a deal with United to take back some transborder flying.

[Bede]

It is indeed complicated, however… Is your new AIP not good enough to to retain jr WJ pilots? What about flow from encore? Not good enough to attract them either?

You raise a good point. I don't know the reasons for why younger pilots choose AC over WJ but my guess is that the upgrade times play a big role. We're still looking at a 9 year upgrade, which historically, is still good, but not as good as a 2 year upgrade at AC.

[Jimmy_Hoffa]

It is indeed complicated, however… Is your new AIP not good enough to to retain jr WJ pilots? What about flow from encore? Not good enough to attract them either?

You raise a good point. I don't know the reasons for why younger pilots choose AC over WJ but my guess is that the upgrade times play a big role. We're still looking at a 9 year upgrade, which historically, is still good, but not as good as a 2 year upgrade at AC.

Hopefully both companies continue to be viable career choices. The more they compete for that limited pool of labour right now the better we collectively will be going forward. If the Reuters article proves true about another 20 787’s the WB FO and NB Capt upgrades will continue for the foreseeable future and that hopefully AC will try and attract that qualified labour. I know most of the people in my circle of influence applied to both carriers and it was simply a matter of who called first. Aviation is a strange industry and can turn on a dime both good and bad. At the end of the day though you had better enjoy the seat you are in and don’t have your hopes pinned on that shiny new plane the boss is telling you will arrive “soon.”

-Jimmy

[sstaurus]

If you were trying to plan what to do with perhaps 30 years or more remaining in your career, which airline gives ultimate stability in Canada? (I know that doesn't really exist in aviation). Even with expansion and contraction, In Canada, AC really is the only option for the career variety, international reach, and a sense that AC will always be around in some form. Again, everyone’s goals are different, but I think that’s why it’ll be a while to see a shortage show up in AC ground schools.

[rudder]

https://stocks.apple.com/A7AhMDCFSTUWWFvPcEDj71Q

[DanWEC]

Air Canada said in an email “the existing contract, which has been in place for nearly a decade, is a testimony to the productive relationship we have with our pilots. We expect the upcoming negotiations to be conducted in this same spirit.”

...and the next paragraph...

The current agreement with pilots is in force until Sept. 29, Air Canada said. Since landing on a 10-year collective agreement in 2014, Air Canada pilots have received a two per cent pay hike each year.

I'm speechless.

[Tbayer2021]

Air Canada said in an email “the existing contract, which has been in place for nearly a decade, is a testimony to the productive relationship we have with our pilots. We expect the upcoming negotiations to be conducted in this same spirit.”

...and the next paragraph...

The current agreement with pilots is in force until Sept. 29, Air Canada said. Since landing on a 10-year collective agreement in 2014, Air Canada pilots have received a two per cent pay hike each year.

I'm speechless.

They're not wrong, it is very productive. Just not for the pilots.

[a2btrail]

Air Canada said in an email “the existing contract, which has been in place for nearly a decade, is a testimony to the productive relationship we have with our pilots. We expect the upcoming negotiations to be conducted in this same spirit.”

...and the next paragraph...

The current agreement with pilots is in force until Sept. 29, Air Canada said. Since landing on a 10-year collective agreement in 2014, Air Canada pilots have received a two per cent pay hike each year.

I'm speechless.

lol

[RippleRock]

Air Canada said in an email “the existing contract, which has been in place for nearly a decade, is a testimony to the productive relationship we have with our pilots. We expect the upcoming negotiations to be conducted in this same spirit.”

...and the next paragraph...

The current agreement with pilots is in force until Sept. 29, Air Canada said. Since landing on a 10-year collective agreement in 2014, Air Canada pilots have received a two per cent pay hike each year.

I'm speechless.

They're not wrong, it is very productive. Just not for the pilots.

Agreed. We lost most of that 2% during the Covid "giveback". Those furloughed gave even more. Our CEO was rewarded for his contribution with a 233% uplift. We who went to 55 hour blocks got a "pat on the back", while those furloughed get jack. These are facts.

What's the definition of "insulting" again? FYI, you just were.

Keep giving us reasons.

[airbussy]

Air Canada said in an email “the existing contract, which has been in place for nearly a decade, is a testimony to the productive relationship we have with our pilots. We expect the upcoming negotiations to be conducted in this same spirit.”

...and the next paragraph...

The current agreement with pilots is in force until Sept. 29, Air Canada said. Since landing on a 10-year collective agreement in 2014, Air Canada pilots have received a two per cent pay hike each year.

I'm speechless.

It's just management posturing for the investors. Think nothing more of this comment than that.

Labour instability is not good for the markets, they will do everything they can to sell to the investors that "EVERYTHING IS FINE" until it's clear that it's not.

My biggest question the last two+ years is, Where the @#$! is the BOD?

[altiplano]

Enjoy your summer.

Don't lift a finger outside of your block.
Fock VO & draft.
No sim seat fills.
No extending unforeseen.
Follow the contract.
No coordinating other departments' problems with STOC.

This place won't function without us going 110%.
That's what they rely on.

This makes it easier for our NC to achieve what we want.
The company will feel the burn and sense the urgency of getting a deal when Q3, their #1 quarter, starts looking like it's going south. They can't afford that.

Our union can't say this so don't wait for it to come from them, but you know it's true. Now is the time to apply the pressure.

If you're on the VO list, if you're cashing in this year on the sacrifice of others for our greater good then you're a snake and a damn fool and it won't go unnoticed. Be ready to finish your career in solitude, or maybe you and Microphone Mike and The Dumb Brother can all go out together.

[airbussy]

Enjoy your summer.

Don't lift a finger outside of your block.
Fock VO & draft.
No sim seat fills.
No extending unforeseen.
Follow the contract.
No coordinating other departments' problems with STOC.

This place won't function without us going 110%.
That's what they rely on.

This makes it easier for our NC to achieve what we want.
The company will feel the burn and sense the urgency of getting a deal when Q3, their #1 quarter, starts looking like it's going south. They can't afford that.

Our union can't say this so don't wait for it to come from them, but you know it's true. Now is the time to apply the pressure.

If you're on the VO list, if you're cashing in this year on the sacrifice of others for our greater good then you're a snake and a damn fool and it won't go unnoticed. Be ready to finish your career in solitude, or maybe you and Microphone Mike and The Dumb Brother can all go out together.

100%

Show up 1:15 before, stop for food, make sure everyone is briefed fully, taxi at a safe speed etc.

And if you're on reserve, stop flying into G days. It will wreak havoc on the WB operation.

Just arriving 1:15 before for WB flights will probably do enough but we need everyone to do it. Every international flight will depart late.

[cjp]

Enjoy your summer.

Don't lift a finger outside of your block.
Fock VO & draft.
No sim seat fills.
No extending unforeseen.
Follow the contract.
No coordinating other departments' problems with STOC.

This place won't function without us going 110%.
That's what they rely on.

This makes it easier for our NC to achieve what we want.
The company will feel the burn and sense the urgency of getting a deal when Q3, their #1 quarter, starts looking like it's going south. They can't afford that.

Our union can't say this so don't wait for it to come from them, but you know it's true. Now is the time to apply the pressure.

If you're on the VO list, if you're cashing in this year on the sacrifice of others for our greater good then you're a snake and a damn fool and it won't go unnoticed. Be ready to finish your career in solitude, or maybe you and Microphone Mike and The Dumb Brother can all go out together.

100%

Show up 1:15 before, stop for food, make sure everyone is briefed fully, taxi at a safe speed etc.

And if you're on reserve, stop flying into G days. It will wreak havoc on the WB operation.

Just arriving 1:15 before for WB flights will probably do enough but we need everyone to do it. Every international flight will depart late.

The winds of change are here.