Runway Excursion Thread

[pelmet]

From TSB....

C-FKGL, a Douglas DC3C operated by North Star Air Ltd. as flight BF102 departed Wunnumin
Lake (CKL3), ON, to Pickle Lake (CYPL), ON. The aircraft was landing on Runway 27 at CYPL
when the flight crew experienced a loss of control due to a flat left main tire. The aircraft veered to
the left and experienced a runway side excursion. The left main wheel dug into the soft turf causing
the aircraft to enter a rapid tight left turn. The aircraft damage was limited to the left main wheel
assembly. There were no injuries.

[W5]

I.e groundloop

[Dry Guy]

Kind of scary that a flat tire leads to loss of control. Would this be one of the larger planes with single tires per main gear?

[sunk]

Kind of scary that a flat tire leads to loss of control. Would this be one of the larger planes with single tires per main gear?
It’s a tail dragger, I could see this happening if the flat tire dug into the soft dirt. Not sure how effective the old brakes on a 3 are!

[I WAS Pez]

I think a flat on a main on most taildraggers will likely be very unpleasant.... likely a ground loop, and on many of the smaller ones, significant damage.

Thinking about the bigger taildraggers..... They're pretty much all WWII era (or earlier), and the ones that come to mind pretty much all have single wheel main gear.

Only flat I've had so far was on a glider with a single main wheel aft of the CG, and it was interesting how quickly it went sideways (literally). No damage, but if it'd been one of the mains on a light taildragger, it would not have been good.

[Donald]

Was this actually from the TSB, or is it the preliminary info from a CADORS report?

I'd be curious if the left main was indeed flat prior to landing, or was caused by a groundloop during the landing.

Either way, this particular airframe has led a hard life with North Star.

[pelmet]

Was this actually from the TSB, or is it the preliminary info from a CADORS report?

I'd be curious if the left main was indeed flat prior to landing, or was caused by a groundloop during the landing.

Either way, this particular airframe has led a hard life with North Star.

Sigh....

I went through months of difficulty being accused of making up reports, so I started always posting my incident reports with "From TSB......"

Yet it is still asked where the report is from.

[goldeneagle]

Kind of scary that a flat tire leads to loss of control. Would this be one of the larger planes with single tires per main gear?

Have you flown much in taildraggers ? Ever flown a DC3 ?

[Donald]

Was this actually from the TSB, or is it the preliminary info from a CADORS report?

I'd be curious if the left main was indeed flat prior to landing, or was caused by a groundloop during the landing.

Either way, this particular airframe has led a hard life with North Star.

Sigh....

I went through months of difficulty being accused of making up reports, so I started always posting my incident reports with "From TSB......"

Yet it is still asked where the report is from.

Wasn't accusing you of anything, I just couldn't find the report on the TSB site, and was interested in reading more. Is there a link to it?

[TailwheelPilot]

No, it is not on the website and there is no link to it. It is from the daily email they send out. There is no more to read, that is the entirety of it (at this point, at least).

https://forms-formulaires.alpha.canada.ca/id/2

Select the Air (Daily) option at the bottom in the Notifications section.

[Donald]

No, it is not on the website and there is no link to it. It is from the daily email they send out. There is no more to read, that is the entirety of it (at this point, at least).

https://forms-formulaires.alpha.canada.ca/id/2

Select the Air (Daily) option at the bottom in the Notifications section.

Thanks

[pelmet]

There have been many times where I have read about(or watched a video of) a runway excursion incident where the aircraft was not damaged until the pilot decided to power back onto the runway or taxiway. Engines can suck in things when high power is used, propeller blades can strike the ground due to uneven/soft terrain or the gear can be damaged in the process.

Consider leaving the aircraft where it is unless you are absolutely sure that you can safely get back to the runway/taxiway/ramp.

From ASRS.....

"This Citation Captain experienced circumstances that
resulted in a high-energy approach. The approach was
continued, but the landing imposed two serious surprises.
n On approach to Runway XX into the ZZZ airport, we
were kept high and left of center due to an approaching
aircraft into ZZZ1. We were prevented from making a proper
pattern due to the approaching traffic and had less than the
expected time to descend. We approached faster than normal
and were able to lower landing flaps at approximately 500
feet [AGL] and retract speedbrakes around 50 to 75 feet.
Our fast approach speed caused a longer than normal float
above the runway, and we were not able to touch down until
the 4,000 [feet] remaining sign. We applied full brakes, but
the higher-than-normal touchdown speed and high altitude
of the airport caused a slower than normal deceleration.
We were unable to stop the aircraft and exited the end of the
runway into a gravel overrun pad. On the gravel pad, the
First Officer (FO) exited the plane and inspected the landing
gear, noting no damage. In an attempt to taxi back onto the
runway, the nose gear caught on the edge of the runway, and
the nose gear collapsed."

[airway]

I.e groundloop

Isn't a ground loop more of an aerodynamic thing where the wings are still producing lift, rather than catching a tire in the dirt?


.

[I WAS Pez]

I.e groundloop

Isn't a ground loop more of an aerodynamic thing where the wings are still producing lift, rather than catching a tire in the dirt?


.

More a C of G thing. C of G is in front of the mains on a tricycle gear aircraft, behind it on a taildragger....That makes a taildragger pretty unstable when moving on the ground....ie, always trying to ground loop. Think shopping cart being pushed forward for tricycle and backward for a taildragger. That's sorta the rough idea.

If any speed is involved, ground loops frequently (but not always) involve significant damage - often a wingtip (and associated wing structure) and/or prop strike....

[pelmet]

There have been many times where I have read about(or watched a video of) a runway excursion incident where the aircraft was not damaged until the pilot decided to power back onto the runway or taxiway. Engines can suck in things when high power is used, propeller blades can strike the ground due to uneven/soft terrain or the gear can be damaged in the process.

Consider leaving the aircraft where it is unless you are absolutely sure that you can safely get back to the runway/taxiway/ramp.

From ASRS.....

"This Citation Captain experienced circumstances that
resulted in a high-energy approach. The approach was
continued, but the landing imposed two serious surprises.
n On approach to Runway XX into the ZZZ airport, we
were kept high and left of center due to an approaching
aircraft into ZZZ1. We were prevented from making a proper
pattern due to the approaching traffic and had less than the
expected time to descend. We approached faster than normal
and were able to lower landing flaps at approximately 500
feet [AGL] and retract speedbrakes around 50 to 75 feet.
Our fast approach speed caused a longer than normal float
above the runway, and we were not able to touch down until
the 4,000 [feet] remaining sign. We applied full brakes, but
the higher-than-normal touchdown speed and high altitude
of the airport caused a slower than normal deceleration.
We were unable to stop the aircraft and exited the end of the
runway into a gravel overrun pad. On the gravel pad, the
First Officer (FO) exited the plane and inspected the landing
gear, noting no damage. In an attempt to taxi back onto the
runway, the nose gear caught on the edge of the runway, and
the nose gear collapsed."

Meanwhile,

It looks like AC had an excursion in Paris but did not try to escape their predicament. Well, it does say they were unable to move, so not sure how they confirmed that.

One has to be careful in CDG. You have these one-way taxiways and if taxiing the proper way, the corners have been rounded out at the turns you are allowed to make in order to give the longbody aft gear more room while they tend to be pointed at turns where you are not allowed to turn. We had that happen to one crew that took out a light without knowing(or acknowledging it) after getting on a wrong taxiway. It was only a few weeks later that the airport was able to figure it out using ground radar records. A bit of it can be seen in the diagrams in this report.

https://skybrary.aero/accidents-and-inc ... rance-2000

From TSB.....

C-GFAJ, an Air Canada A330 was operating flight ACA0875 from Paris Charles de Gaulle Airport
(LFPG), France to Montréal/Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport (CYUL), QC. During taxi for
departure the aircraft taxied off the taxiway while making a left turn. The left gear was stuck in the
mud and was unable to move. Passengers deplaned safely and the aircraft was removed using a
crane.
Inspections of the main landing gear were carrier out by maintenance in accordance with the AMM.
Main landing gear wheels replaced and ops checks of the braking system performed with no faults
found.

The airport also has lots of sloping taxiways as well to make things interesting.

[pelmet]

Not quite an excursion but close.......

The privately registered Piper J3 Cub, C-FEGF, was doing circuits at the Whitehorse International
Airport (CYXY), YT. On the last approach to Runway 14L the pilot was unable to differentiate the
runway from the infield to right of the runway. During the flare the aircraft drifted to the right and
touched down in snow that was deep enough to result in a rapid deceleration. The aircraft nosed
over and came to rest on its back. The pilot was uninjured and was able to extricate himself from
the aircraft. There was no fire, and the ELT did not activate; ARFF did respond. Flat light and
blowing snow conditions were prevalent at the time of the occurrence.

...from TSB.

[pelmet]

From TSB....

C-FLQQ, a private Mooney M-20 K was conducting a flight from Great Falls International Airport
(KGTF), Montana, to Mexico Airdrome (NY96), New York, with only the pilot on board. During
cruise at FL240, the engine had a drop in oil pressure and a loss of power. The airplane diverted to
Burley Municipal Airport (KBYI), Idaho. The airplane was high and fast on final approach at KBYI
that resulted in a long landing. The airplane departed to end of the runway and struck a fence and
metal container before coming to rest.
The National Transportation Safety Board is investigating.

[pelmet]

Ramp in this case......

C-GKQJ, an Embraer ERJ 190-400 (E195-E2) operated by Porter Airlines (Canada) Inc., was
conducting flight POE505 from Ottawa Macdonald-Cartier International Airport (CYOW), ON, to
Orlando International Airport (KMCO), FL, USA. During the initial turn after pushback, the nose
gear left the paved surface of the apron and came to rest in a snow-covered grass area adjacent to
apron 1. This occurred during the hours of darkness, and reported weather conditions included low
visibility due to snow and blowing snow. The airport authority made arrangements for airstairs and
buses to transport the passengers back to the terminal. The aircraft was towed to a location where
it could be inspected per the manufacturer's procedures. There was no damage found, and the
aircraft was returned to service.


....From TSB.

[pelmet]

From TSB....

C-FIOH, a Swearingen SA227-AC operated by 2080061 Ontario Inc. (dba SkyCare Air
Ambulance), was conducting a medevac flight from Thunder Bay Airport (CYQT), ON, to Dryden
Regional Airport (CYHD), ON. During the landing roll on Runway 12 at CYHD, directional control
was lost at a low speed. The aircraft departed the runway to the south and entered the gravel
surface. The aircraft was shutdown. There were no injuries and the patient was transferred to a
waiting ambulance. The pilots subsequently inspected the aircraft and taxied to the apron. There
was no damage to the aircraft.
The operator's maintenance verified there was no damage and the aircraft was returned to service.

[W5]

From TSB....

C-FLQQ, a private Mooney M-20 K was conducting a flight from Great Falls International Airport
(KGTF), Montana, to Mexico Airdrome (NY96), New York, with only the pilot on board. During
cruise at FL240, the engine had a drop in oil pressure and a loss of power. The airplane diverted to
Burley Municipal Airport (KBYI), Idaho. The airplane was high and fast on final approach at KBYI
that resulted in a long landing. The airplane departed to end of the runway and struck a fence and
metal container before coming to rest.
The National Transportation Safety Board is investigating.

That would have been a very strange routing. More likely on his way to Mexico, the country.

[pelmet]

From TSB...

C-FGYS, a McDonnell Douglas A4-N, was being operated by Top Aces Inc. out of Cold
Lake/Group Captain R.W. McNair Airport (CYOD), AB. During rollout after landing on RWY31L,
while decelerating through 50 knots, the aircraft began to veer to the right. The pilot added more
left brake but this had no effect and eventually the left pedal was on the floor. The pilot activated
nose wheel steering and continued to use right brake. This worked until about 10 knots ground
speed when directional control was lost; no steering and only right brake. The pilot continued to
use right brake to slow and the aircraft departed the right side of the runway coming to rest in grass
about 150 feet off the runway. There was no damage to the aircraft and the pilot was uninjured.

[pelmet]

From TSB...

N858CD, a Cirrus SR22 aircraft, was on a flight from Montréal/St-Hubert Airport (CYHU), QC, and
landing at the Rideau Lakes Aerodrome (CRL2). The aircraft touched down on the grass/gravel
runway, slightly left of the centerline and began to drift left. The pilot was unable maintain
directional control of the aircraft and it exited the left side of the runway. The aircraft travelled in an
arc through some tall grass and collided with some trees. The pilot and passengers were able to
egress the aircraft and there were no injuries. The aircraft was substantially damaged from the
impact with the trees.

[pelmet]

From TSB.....

C-GTJB, a privately registered Piper PA46-350P, was conducting an IFR flight from
Edmonton/Villeneuve Airport (CZVL), AB, to Fort McMurray Airport (CYMM), AB, with the pilot and
1 passenger on board. During the rollout after touchdown on Runway 08 in CYMM, the aircraft
veered to the right. Despite full left rudder and left brake, the aircraft departed the runway surface.
Shortly after departing the paved surface the nose landing gear collapsed and the propeller struck
the ground. The pilot and passenger egressed from the main cabin door with no injuries.

Nice airplane. Hopefully someone can provide more info.

[pelmet]

From TSB...

C-GEYL, a privately registered Piper PA-28-180 was on a visual flight rules flight from the Olds-
Didsbury Aerodrome (CEA3), AB to the Okotoks Air Ranch Airport (CFX2), AB. The pilot was the
sole occupant. Upon touchdown on Runway 34, the aircraft bounced and the plane veered left and
the aircraft exited the runway onto the grass. During the runway excursion the left wing struck the
Alpha Taxiway sign. The leading edge of the left wing had substantial damage and the taxiway
sign was also damaged. The pilot, who was uninjured, taxied the aircraft to the apron and shut
down.

[pelmet]

From TSB...

C-GIKY, a Cessna 172 operated by Integrated Sensing & Surveillance Inc. (ISSINC), was
conducting a flight from Lloydminster Airport (CYLL), AB, to conduct some survey work and then
proceed to Kindersley Regional Aerodrome (CYKY), SK, with 2 souls on board. After finishing the
survey work, the pilot noticed that a storm had developed between their position and CYKY. The
pilot proceeded east to avoid the cell. Checking the weather report, the pilot determined that the
winds favored Runway 17 and proceeded to join a left base for Runway 17. When established on
final approach, rain started adhering to the windshield and made it difficult for the pilot to see the
runway. The pilot then decided to cross overhead to join a left hand downwind for Runway 26
instead. At this point the storm was approaching from the north. The pilot turned base and tried to
slow down to the approach speed and set full flaps. The pilot ended up high and fast and floated
quite far in the flare; touching down approximately 2/3rds of the way down the runway. The pilot
then retracted the flaps and tried to stop the aircraft as quickly as possible without locking the
brakes. The aircraft overran the end of Runway 26 by approximately 20 feet. The pilot then turned
the aircraft around and taxied back to the apron, shut down the aircraft, and inspected it for
damage. There was no damage. There were no injuries.