Crash and fire at Lake Simcoe Regional

[PilotDAR]

CTV News in Barrie is reporting:

https://barrie.ctvnews.ca/3-people-esca ... -1.6999226

[Pratt X 3]

https://asn.flightsafety.org/wikibase/410623

Narrative:
A FLYGTA Airlines Inc Beechcraft B100 King Air, performing flight TOR804, callsign "Homerun 804", experienced a gear up landing on runway 28 at Lake Simcoe Regional Airport (YLK/CYLS), Ontario.
The three crew members were uninjured and the aircraft was destroyed by fire.

[Dias]

Remember Doc? That guy ensured I never landed gear up. And never spent my life in 703.

[rookiepilot]

How does a gear up landing cause a fire like that?

[PilotDAR]

Well, without knowing anything whatever about the circumstances of this accident, I can say that fires, and other in flight failures, have been the reason that landing gear did not extend when selected. So until more information is made available, I'm treating this as chicken and egg...

[DONALD J TRUMP]

Glad everyone was able to walk away. Could have been a lot worse by the looks of the pics...

[digits_]

The one thing I remember from my King Air training, is that there was a rare but fairly well known failure mode of the flap motor where it would not shut off, burn itself out, and start a fire coming from the cabin floor.

Looking at the picture, if we -possibly incorrectly- assume the fire started in the middle of the damage, it would be right above the flap motor. The route of flight seems to be long enough for a TO issue with the flaps to become an issue around the arrival airport.

[Heavy Rayn]

I heard they reported smoke in the cockpit before the emergency landing in YLS.

[spruceair]

The one thing I remember from my King Air training, is that there was a rare but fairly well known failure mode of the flap motor where it would not shut off, burn itself out, and start a fire coming from the cabin floor.

I’ve had something close to this happen in a 200. Retracted the flaps after start, started taxiing for departure and had a passenger tap us on the shoulders saying smoke was coming from the floor. We quickly realized the flap breaker had popped. Killed all electrics and turned back to the hangar. Ended up being mechanically stuck and burnt out the motor. Happened very quickly. Glad we had this happen to us on the ground.

[‘Bob’]

Remember Doc? That guy ensured I never landed gear up. And never spent my life in 703.

Sure that wasn’t EGPWS?

[digits_]

The one thing I remember from my King Air training, is that there was a rare but fairly well known failure mode of the flap motor where it would not shut off, burn itself out, and start a fire coming from the cabin floor.

I’ve had something close to this happen in a 200. Retracted the flaps after start, started taxiing for departure and had a passenger tap us on the shoulders saying smoke was coming from the floor. We quickly realized the flap breaker had popped. Killed all electrics and turned back to the hangar. Ended up being mechanically stuck and burnt out the motor. Happened very quickly. Glad we had this happen to us on the ground.

Oh wow I didn't expect it to start smoking that quickly. Did popping the breaker not stop the smoking?

[spruceair]

The one thing I remember from my King Air training, is that there was a rare but fairly well known failure mode of the flap motor where it would not shut off, burn itself out, and start a fire coming from the cabin floor.

I’ve had something close to this happen in a 200. Retracted the flaps after start, started taxiing for departure and had a passenger tap us on the shoulders saying smoke was coming from the floor. We quickly realized the flap breaker had popped. Killed all electrics and turned back to the hangar. Ended up being mechanically stuck and burnt out the motor. Happened very quickly. Glad we had this happen to us on the ground.

Oh wow I didn't expect it to start smoking that quickly. Did popping the breaker not stop the smoking?

It did, but we killed all electrical just be sure. Taxied back and shutdown.

[pelmet]

I heard they reported smoke in the cockpit before the emergency landing in YLS.

A good example of the false rumour mill after an accident.

Had a check pilot on board. My suggestion would be for the check pilot to always wait until the gear has been selected down before going to his seat in the back...

C-FTFT, a Beech B100 operated by FLYGTA Inc., departed Toronto/Lester B. Pearson
International Airport (CYYZ), ON, with 2 crew and 1 check pilot on board. The flight was to be
conducted in the vicinity of Lake Simcoe Regional Aerodrome (CYLS), ON, and was to be a PPC
check flight for the left seat pilot. During the majority of the check flight, the check pilot was seated
on a divan behind the pilots so that he could observe the flight crew and flight instruments by
leaning into the cockpit area, but during the takeoff and landings he would sit on a forward-facing
seat at the rear of the aircraft where he could wear a seatbelt. From this position, he listened to the
crew and issued instructions through the intercom system using his headset.
The second approach, which was an RNAV approach to Runway 28 at CYLS, included a simulated
engine failure, and was planned to continue to a full stop landing. The approach was proceeding
normally, and the check pilot went to sit in the back of the aircraft once the crew had become
established on their final approach path. Although the before landing checklist was conducted, the
landing gear was not extended during the approach, and the propellers contacted the runway
during the landing flare, after which the engine nacelles and the rear fuselage contacted the
runway. The aircraft slid to a stop on the runway approximately 2500 feet after the first propeller
strike.
Shortly after coming to a stop, the crew observed smoke and an electrical smell coming from the
area behind the left-hand edge of the instrument panel. The crew shut down the aircraft and used
an onboard fire extinguisher in an attempt to prevent a fire, but the smoke continued and increased
in intensity. All 3 occupants exited the aircraft and were uninjured. Within a few minutes, flames
became visible inside the aircraft. The local fire department arrived and doused the fire before it
spread to the wings; although the entire upper fuselage and aircraft interior was consumed by fire
and the aircraft was destroyed. The cause of the fire has not been determined.


...from TSB

https://www.google.ca/search?sca_esv=0d ... sid=mosaic

[digits_]

So a partial pass?

[PilotDAR]

Pilots can get used to the false confidence that a warning horn will sound if the gear is not extended during approach. There are at least three possible reasons why a warning horn might not sound when the gear is not selected down yet a landing conducted: The horn itself might be U/S (I have had once - so I do check them), the pilot might carry power right into the flare, so that if the warning horn switch is never closed by throttles/power levers to idle, the warning horn will not sound, or, the plane may not have a warning horn at all (amphibian/wheelski equipped).

When doing some flight testing in a Navajo many years ago, I reminded myself that I was cheating myself out of a possible warning, by carrying power through the flare (which the plane seemed nice with). So I got into the habit mid approach, after selecting and checking gear down, to momentarily close the throttles to listen for the horn. Also, when it was appropriate in flight, I might close a throttle momentarily to assure I heard a horn when I should.

But, I always do, and train, confirming the gear position, and stating it out loud, along with the intended landing surface during approach. That is a never fail system for confirming correct gear selection. And, if you think stating "wheels down for landing on land" sounds kinda redundant for an RG landplane, consider it is plausible that one day you could be saying "wheels are up for an intentional belly landing/ditching". Just get into the habit of observing and stating out loud gear position, no one will ever think the less of you for doing it!

[pelmet]

Sometimes it is just distracting chatter. I fellow I know with loads of experience in tough flying situations got right to the flare on a friend's plane(then went around) after having three chatty ladies as passengers in an ash drop who were talking a lot. The one time I forgot prior to landing(until warned on base leg) also involved a lot of chatter.

My theory for small airplanes is(within reason)....the first time you think about extending the gear is likely a good time to prepare for and extend the gear. It may be the last time you think about it(for unexpected reasons).

[PilotDAR]

My theory for small airplanes is(within reason)....the first time you think about extending the gear is likely a good time to prepare for and extend the gear. It may be the last time you think about it

My perspective is different. Sure, select the landing gear position whenever you like, but the checking of the intended configuration must be the disciplined effort. If the first deliberate check is closely preceded by selecting the landing gear position, so much the better. Downwind is a good place to be in the habit of choosing the landing gear position, selecting it, and confirming the desired configuration has been achieved. Then, I like to see the pilot repeat the confirmation of configuration on final, while you're looking at what you're going to land on. Say what you're going to land on, and where the gear is having looked at all of it.

Example of bad: Pilots takes off runway in an amphibious floatplane, He selects gear up, and continues to the camp. Seemingly, there was no landing gear position check prior to landing. Gear is down, plane flips, pilot drowns. TSB confirms that the switch was selected up for a water landing, but the wheels were all down. 'Turns out when the gear was selected up, instead of coming up, the pump popped the breaker, and all of that went entirely un noticed. The wheels were down the entire flight, and that could have been easily visually detected. Perhaps the pilot confirmed the switch was selected up. Cabin chatter was a likely distraction in that case.

You are entitled to have your passengers hush up when you ask - any time you ask!

[pelmet]

My theory for small airplanes is(within reason)....the first time you think about extending the gear is likely a good time to prepare for and extend the gear. It may be the last time you think about it

My perspective is different. Sure, select the landing gear position whenever you like, but the checking of the intended configuration must be the disciplined effort. If the first deliberate check is closely preceded by selecting the landing gear position, so much the better. Downwind is a good place to be in the habit of choosing the landing gear position, selecting it, and confirming the desired configuration has been achieved. Then, I like to see the pilot repeat the confirmation of configuration on final, while you're looking at what you're going to land on. Say what you're going to land on, and where the gear is having looked at all of it.

Thanks,

Your advice is appreciated and is good advice.

However, one thing to keep in mind is that downwind is not always flown. Sometimes it is a base leg or straight-in and at a very busy controlled airport, which when unfamiliar, can be even more difficult. In addition, it can get very busy at uncontrolled airports looking for traffic while on downwind or prior to. I prefer to have my landing checks done earlier and then follow your advice for the confirmations. Certainly, if one is expecting to be busy when close to the airport, whether due to traffic or other reasons, I prefer to get optional items out of the way to remove heads down time when closer-in.

This King Air accident is different as it is an IFR operation and with a simulated engine failure. In the end, one just does have to remember the gear at the appropriate time.

[PilotDAR]

However, one thing to keep in mind is that downwind is not always flown

Fair enough, let's change the term to "in range [check]". I don't mind where you are relative to commencing final approach, and I don't mind how long (or short) final approach is, as long as you have allowed yourself the time to prevent task saturation, traffic and cabin distraction from distracting you from required pilot actions. If all of it is done on a very long straight in final, sure. If all of it is done before you swing on to a short slant final, that's okay too. As long as it is done appropriately close to landing. I don't accept the in range check being done at top of descent, too many things happen after that that can change factors affecting a safe landing.

The point is to build into every pre approach to landing a mental space to assure configuration without distraction. Distraction is unacceptable for that brief action, and failing to assure configuration is unacceptable - even if the configuration was correct. It's the assurance of a configuration check in time which is important.

[rookiepilot]

Sterile cabin in the pattern / below 1000 coming or going.

Pretty simple.

And I don’t even need a fifth checklist.

[pelmet]

Sterile cabin in the pattern / below 1000 coming or going.

Pretty simple.

And I don’t even need a fifth checklist.

Simple or simplistic?

How is that simple advice applicable the hundreds(probably thousands) of pilots who have been and will be alone on the aircraft and experience gear up landings?

[rookiepilot]

Sterile cabin in the pattern / below 1000 coming or going.

Pretty simple.

And I don’t even need a fifth checklist.

Simple or simplistic?

How is that simple advice applicable the hundreds(probably thousands) of pilots who have been and will be alone on the aircraft and experience gear up landings?

GUMPS has been around for a long time.

Oh, and stay off Instagram

[PilotDAR]

Sterile cabin in the pattern / below 1000 coming or going

I could never chat with my passenger!

[pelmet]

Sterile cabin in the pattern / below 1000 coming or going

I could never chat with my passenger!

Like I said, it was simplistic advice. Double check(or triple) your gear position after your landing checklist/GUMP). Maybe even 5 times on occasion. It should be a paranoia item.