Seniority at AC Mainline

Big M.A.C. · Post by **Big M.A.C.** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 6:18 pm

Hi All,

Another question about the process, is it true that seniority is established in the class by basically pulling a number out of a hat? Just curious...

Prospect · Post by **Prospect** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 6:26 pm

yes, except Jazz guys get the top spots first and then the rest pick numbers out of a hat.

tonysoprano · Post by **tonysoprano** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 6:27 pm

They use to go by exam marks. Then they started pulling names out a hat. Jazz guys are given seniority above the others.

pilotbzh · Post by **pilotbzh** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 7:17 pm

Deleted.....

didn't Mean to be bitching, just wanted to informed.

popo · Post by **popo** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 6:04 am

it was your choice to go and work for Jazz so stop bitching.

You are lucky you can carry some of your seniority toward salary.
if you don t like it, turn the job down. Someone else will be happy to take it.

PeteThePilot · Post by **PeteThePilot** » Tue Jun 19, 2007 3:44 pm

We've got a bleeder over here!

popo · Post by **popo** » Wed Jun 20, 2007 6:57 am

I think Jazz guys..should be out in the hat like everyone else.

Sage · Post by **Sage** » Wed Jun 20, 2007 8:04 am

Keeping thinking that. It's not going to happen...we're at the top and so we should being little brother and all. We shouldn't have to wait til the end of 2 years in order to cross over either but we do.

flyinphil · Post by **flyinphil** » Wed Jun 20, 2007 8:17 am

Boy, the sense of entitlement makes people say funny things..

disco · Post by **disco** » Wed Jun 20, 2007 8:36 am

By the way,

If you were to call it AC and leave out the Mainline part (as in "AC Mainline"), we would all know who you were talking about.

Most people know who Air Canada is without the Mainline...

Glen Quagmire · Post by **Glen Quagmire** » Wed Jun 20, 2007 9:01 am

pilotbzh you don't have to feel bad, I saw it as an honest approach to try and inform people as to what the process looks like for a Jazz pilot.

The process is what it is, negotiated by powers that be. The pilots from both Jazz and the street had no say in this and therefore shouldn't attack each other over it.

If there were in the world today any large number of people who desired their own happiness more than they desired the unhappiness of others, we could have paradise in a few years.
Bertrand Russell

F-16 · Post by **F-16** » Wed Jun 20, 2007 10:21 pm

Not trying to burst any bubbles - BUT, there's nothing stating that people from Jazz should/will get/are entitled to the top #'s in a grounschool.

It's one of those things that just happened...

Whether it's right or fair, it depends on who you talk to.

It is what it is.

Jaques Strappe · Post by **Jaques Strappe** » Thu Jun 21, 2007 6:22 am

F-16 wrote:Not trying to burst any bubbles - BUT, there's nothing stating that people from Jazz should/will get/are entitled to the top #'s in a grounschool.

It's one of those things that just happened...

Whether it's right or fair, it depends on who you talk to.

It is what it is.

Yes there is. It started in 1995 when applicants from the connectors had been accepted only to be "frozen" at the connector while others who were able to be at the course date, jumped ahead. At first, management at the connector level would not disclose who was being frozen. A group of pilots got together and faxed ACPA a list of almost 100 pilots being held back by a "freeze". ACPA secured seniority numbers for them. Since then and since the Voisy award, connector pilots are given their seniority while fulfilling the freeze. That is why a Jazz pilot is at the top of the class seniority wise, he probably should have been on the property 10 courses ago had he been allowed to resign from Jazz and begin the course.

People off the street don't realize this and get all bent out of shape. Imagine being told however, " no you are not allowed to quit and if you do, then kiss goodbye that Air Canada offer."

F-16 · Post by **F-16** » Thu Jun 21, 2007 6:54 am

JS,

Thanks for your post. I wasn't, however, talking about those people that were frozen at Jazz, rather those people that transition from Jazz with no freeze, get their numbers like everyone else in their gschool, and there is nothing that states they get the top spots.

I understand those people frozen should be slotted in somewhere, and if they get slotted in at the top (and like you mentioned, it's been happening since 1995), then that's the way it is and I apologize for being misinformed.

I'm am not making a case in favour or against. True some people complain, but generally speaking, a couple of numbers won't make a big difference in the grand scheme of things (ok, maybe for layoffs, etc., but again generally speaking).

Personally, I think that pilots from Jazz do deserve the added benefits they get when they transition over to mainline, having served at Jazz (owned by AC) for x number of years.

What will that look like after 2009 as they are two separate companies with new CB's? It will be interesting.

Jaques Strappe · Post by **Jaques Strappe** » Thu Jun 21, 2007 9:03 am

F-16

The only thing I can think of in todays situation is that those guys coming from Jazz today, are doing so after a freeze. Unless things have changed, I am not sure that a guy from Jazz can just give two weeks notice and show up at the next Air Canada course. A benefit that a guy off the street has.

Perhaps someone from Jazz can clarify?

Glen Quagmire · Post by **Glen Quagmire** » Thu Jun 21, 2007 9:20 am

You are frozen for two years from your last initial course, whether it be on the Dash or RJ. So someone who flew the Dash for the last 5 years would not be frozen. But, and this important, AC can only put 5 Jazz guys in each course so someone hired with no freeze has to wait their turn which can run from 3-6 months. So said pilot would have been maybe a hundred numbers more senior had he not been at Jazz even without being frozen.

So boys and girls enjoy the fact that you fly for the flag carrier of Canada, thousands would love to be there but didn't make it, and don't worry about a couple of hopefully meaningless seniority numbers.

Seniority at AC Mainline

Seniority at AC Mainline

Actually

Re: Actually

interesting