Air Mikisew VS Perimeter....

pilotsdream · Post by **pilotsdream** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 12:07 pm

Which of these two is a better company to go with?
Have been offered a job with both (ofcourse entry level jobs, since just got licence)... Mikisew would be dispatching and Perimeter would be a little bit of everything...
how long is the wait to get into the right seat? pay? work conditions?
I see there is past info on both companies just needed updated information. thanks

ehbuddy · Post by **ehbuddy** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 12:19 pm

It depends where you are currently living..........

If you are already set up in CYMM than go to Mik. If you are living in CYWG then go to Perimeter.

If you live in neither than compare the rents of both places and make your choice then.

pilotsdream · Post by **pilotsdream** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 12:22 pm

Thanks already took that into account... concerned about the integrity of the companies... ect.

coming from the okanagan

Elessar_44 · Post by **Elessar_44** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 12:23 pm

I have a friend at Perimeter who has been waiting on the ramp to transition for almost 2 years now. I don't mind putting in some time on the ground, but 2 years is way, WAY overboard. And I'm not 100% sure on this, but I think the starting wage at Perimeter is $8.25.

pilotsdream · Post by **pilotsdream** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 12:32 pm

Spoke with Cheif pilot this morning he said 8months on ramp/cargo
and it was 9.50 to start

waiting for more info from air mikisew at 1pm...

thank you i really appreicate the personal imput!
keep it coming

xsbank · Post by **xsbank** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 12:54 pm

Gentlemen, 8 months on the ramp is the minimum - most outfits will not check you out in the winter, so count on the Spring at best. When the spring rolls around they will be getting busy and either won't have time to check you out or will say they need you on the ramp.

$9.50 an hour is slave labour and should be outlawed for 'professional pilots.' You are not high school drop-out lunchbuckets that can only hump luggage, you probably have huge debts and are freshly trained pilots. If these outfits are so badly managed that they can't see the value in a young, eager fresh pilot, and don't take every opportunity to train you and check you out, no wonder people bail on them the moment they have enough time or experience to blow.

I dunno, its been a loooong time since I was starting out, but working the ramp for a year is an awful price to pay when times are good and the whole shitteree can come collapsing down on us like 911 and you will end up professional rampees.

pilotsdream · Post by **pilotsdream** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 1:06 pm

Well air mikisew offered 11.50 an hour which is a joke considering the cost of living in fort mac.
it's unfortunate that the wages are so low but you have to start somewhere and really need to get flying time.
Perimeter is expirencing very high turn over right now and all their juniors are moving up quickly (so i'm told)...
Already been on ramp for three years with a contracted company that works for westjet while doing a commercial pilots licence

thanks for all your help...
when compairing the cost of living winnipeg is looking more desirable (as gross as that sounds)

DHC3Rwannafly · Post by **DHC3Rwannafly** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 1:24 pm

PM me if you want some more info on Perimeter...

DHC3Rwannafly · Post by **DHC3Rwannafly** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 1:30 pm

Just to point out, if you go with Mikesew, because they have a diverse fleet, you'll be able to build PIC time, if you get on their caravans, and you can upgrade to their bigger A/C with time. With perimeter, only having the metro II's, (to get hired right seat on) you wont get any PIC time and you'll sit on the right side for a while making peanuts to talk on 22.8 and work the flaps and gear......just a thought Personally, I would choose Mikesew. IMO

Zapp Brannigan · Post by **Zapp Brannigan** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 1:57 pm

cymm is THE most expensive place in Canada to live. Rent will run you from $700 for a room to $1500 for your own place. You need to have some sort of accomadation worked out or know someone. Having another gig there might be a good idea, not sure though if you have to be on at Mikeisew full time, and have no extra time.

TopperHarley · Post by **TopperHarley** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 2:48 pm

DHC3Rwannafly wrote: . With perimeter, only having the metro II's, (to get hired right seat on) you wont get any PIC time and you'll sit on the right side for a while making peanuts to talk on 22.8 and work the flaps and gear......just a thought Personally, I would choose Mikesew. IMO

Not true at all. You dont need your ATPL to go PIC on the metro II or Be-99 (you need it for our Metro III and Dash

. We have had pilots who upgraded to PIC within as little as 1 year. Upgrades are longer now, but they seem to be under 2 years, closer to 1.5 years or less (assuming you start with 250hrs). Some pilots also do the bag-run on the baron for 6 months to build some PIC time.

On paper, I would say Perimeter is a much better company with a better reputation than Mikisiew. The ramp time is DEFINETLY not 8 months. It's closer to 2 years. We do have rampies at the 2 year mark now, but despite that, it's still a good company.

If you want to get flightline ASAP, the shortest ramp time I know is probably NAC (6-12 months). Perimeter does offer good opportunities for advancement though.

If you're willing to go to YTH, the starting pay is higher. I think its around $10-11/hr, with a raise after 3 months, and another raise after 12 months. Some senior guys up here are making $14/hr. The pay in YWG is comparably lower.

xsbank · Post by **xsbank** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 4:16 pm

TWO YEARS? TWO YEARS!!!!???

I give up - I am wasting my finger tips here.

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 5:10 pm

W O W ! ! ! :

I am totally unable to understand why any pilot should be expected to work the ramp period to get to fly an airplane....

......what in hell has happened to aviation?

Kelowna Pilot · Post by **Kelowna Pilot** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 9:19 pm

......what in hell has happened to aviation?

C'mon Cat, you know.

So long as aviation is perceived as being a "glory" job, the supply of wannabes out there will far exceed the demand, resulting in all sorts of weirdness.

Simple supply and demand.

ScudRunner · Post by **ScudRunner** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 11:30 pm

Ya dont buy that 8 month line, you would be Rampy #56 in line for flight crew. Know some that have been there 2 years and are about # 6 in line.

desksgo · Post by **desksgo** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 4:49 am

This is so freaking depressing, boys, for fucks sakes. I know you guys love airplanes more than your own mothers and the idea of flogging around in a 152 on a hot summer with a 250lb instructor turns you on more than spending an enchanting night with a beautiful woman....BUT COME ON. You already pushed cargo, get in your car, drive across the country and get flying. YOU EARNED THE RIGHT, GO BE A PROFESSIONAL.

The industry is better than I have ever seen it, and you wanna flog cargo in YTH for 2 years?

Swerved · Post by **Swerved** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 8:44 am

From an inside source, Mikisew's rampies are also looking at a LONG wait right now. I'm not there anymore (haven't been for years), but I'd make sure you know what you're in for before you go. There's LOTS of turnover there right now, but I fear that most of it is happening at the upper end of the experience scale, and it's not necessarily trickling down as much as would be hoped. Try Northwestern Ontario...NAC or Wasaya would both be good bets. Should be less than a year.
Good luck...

Swerved.

TheEvilTwin · Post by **TheEvilTwin** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 5:37 pm

2 years on the ramp... hope you don't owe any loans or anything... wait a minute.. you can't live on the FO salary either...

DHC3Rwannafly · Post by **DHC3Rwannafly** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 5:45 pm

yeah when i was at perimeter i was in the #40's on the list and some co workers who ahd been there 8 months prior were in the 30's.....thankfully i've found a flying job

DHC3Rwannafly · Post by **DHC3Rwannafly** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 5:46 pm

My mistake C-HRIS I forgot you don't need the atpl for the II's or 99...

ei ei owe · Post by **ei ei owe** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 3:48 am

Cat Driver wrote:
I am totally unable to understand why any pilot should be expected to work the ramp period to get to fly an airplane...?

Not expected to do anything. Choosing to is completely different.

TheEvilTwin · Post by **TheEvilTwin** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 1:06 pm

Totally agree... anyone who is at any company on the ramp for an extended period has made that choice on their own to be there, you don't HAVE to accept a position you don't really want... some guys go instruct, some guys go across the country and look for jobs, some guys releize the whole industry is a BS ride and get on with their lives... anyone who chooses to be on the ramp and makes it, I say congratulations to you cause theres no way I'd do it!

ei ei owe wrote:
Cat Driver wrote:
I am totally unable to understand why any pilot should be expected to work the ramp period to get to fly an airplane...?
Not expected to do anything. Choosing to is completely different.

Pie Lot · Post by **Pie Lot** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 2:20 pm

I don't see anything wrong with going on the ramp. It benefits both the company and the pilot. There just has to be a set maximum amount of time on the ground agreed upon in advance. Then both parties have to honor that agreement.

The rampie, gets a feel for the entire companies operations. Can understand reservations, dispatch, management, procedures etc. Gets to know all the communties, their quirks, agents, etc. And gets to appreciate the chance to fly a plane, rather than expect it as they are a 250hr God!

The company gets usually a superior, eager, intelligent, (and unfortunately cheap overqualified labor). They also get the opportunity to evaluate the wannabe pilot on the ground. Personality traits, work ethic, and general competency will usually be easily detectible from their grouind performance. If the guy/gal is a totally lazy, ahole, Mutt, with a I deserve to be given everything attitude. Then this is easily fixable with little investment in the said candidate when they are given their walking papers.

In our company, 90% of the good pilots have moved up from within. And most of the good ground folks have been placed online long before their one year committment.

xsbank · Post by **xsbank** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 4:28 pm

Sorry Pie Lot, complete twaddle. If you can't pick a guys character in the first few hours in the 'plane, your hiring process is garbage. This ONLY benefits the company. All the rest of that stuff you can learn while being checked out.

Don't you feel just a bit guilty spouting that crap?

DHC3Rwannafly · Post by **DHC3Rwannafly** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 4:38 pm

Pie Lot wrote: And most of the good ground folks have been placed online long before their one year committment.

I don't know what company you work for, but at Perimeter you couldn't buy 1 year on the ramp...and boy don't you feel shitty when you have a bad day, fail your PPC ride and there goes 2 years down the drain....but hey, I guess ATS will like your resume Wink