Fun cheap aerobatic airplane

rd1331 · Post by **rd1331** » Fri Oct 19, 2007 7:56 pm

Anyone have any ideas. Acro Sport I/II? Citabria?

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Fri Oct 19, 2007 8:03 pm

How about a Cri Cri?

Northern Skies · Post by **Northern Skies** » Fri Oct 19, 2007 8:05 pm

Pitts S1S. Dirt cheap.

Of course, a single seat airplane is like masturbation. Half the fun is sharing it.

How about a Culp Special (skybolt with an M14P) (not cheap):

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Fri Oct 19, 2007 8:14 pm

My choice would be a Clipped wing Cub for a cheap aerobatic toy.

sidestick stirrer · Post by **sidestick stirrer** » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:31 pm

I agree with Hedley: the Clipped-wing Cub.
Unfortunately, it's probably not as cheap as it was: I paid 6500 for mine but it was many moons ago.
Hard to go broke feeding 75-100 hp even at full throttle.

Lurch · Post by **Lurch** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 8:08 am

sidestick stirrer wrote:I agree with Hedley: the Clipped-wing Cub.
Unfortunately, it's probably not as cheap as it was: I paid 6500 for mine but it was many moons ago.
Hard to go broke feeding 75-100 hp even at full throttle.

Errr you mean Cat right?

I would go for a Citabria

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 8:30 am

How many here have flown both the Citabria and the clipped wing Cub and done aerobatics in both?

mcrit · Post by **mcrit** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 9:10 am

Citabria's are pretty fun and cheap. There are also more available than there are Clip Wing Cubs. If you already have some aerobatic experience and tail dragger time think about heading straight into a Pitts S1. I've seen them for between $20K-$30K

invertedattitude · Post by **invertedattitude** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 9:13 am

What about the associated costs with owning?

I know there's fuel/maintenance/storage, and of course insurance.

How much per month are guys paying for a $40K airplane roughly? Anyone on here in that boat?

MichaelP · Post by **MichaelP** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 9:37 am

Barry Smith developed an Acro Vee engine for his Tipsy Nipper, competed in intermediate aerobatic competitions and won!

The Tipsy Nipper usually has the Porsche engine but a 1500 VW does the job.

http://www.todayspilot.co.uk/index.html ... 1/1p1.html

desksgo · Post by **desksgo** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 1:38 pm

MichaelP wrote:
The Tipsy Nipper usually has the Porsche engine but a 1500 VW does the job.

http://www.todayspilot.co.uk/index.html ... 1/1p1.html

I fly a Hickadoola Junior Sport, it goes like snot. Hopefully going to finish my project plane the Pixie Dixie Runabout ST

sstaurus · Post by **sstaurus** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 2:56 pm

I bet those Culp Special's aren't cheap, but Wow. There's an older gentleman at Brampton who has one... I've never seen more awesome take-offs! The blades on the 2-blade prop were practically a foot wide! That plus you can't beat radials :p

edit: lol desksgo I can't help but laugh out loud like an idiot everytime i see that avatar ha

GilletteNorth · Post by **GilletteNorth** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 5:28 pm

If I were a rich man, I'd buy a Pitts S2B and hire Hedley to teach me to fly it properly. Forget a Gosport tube, he could sit in back and whack me on the head with a stick when I did something wrong LOL.

Northern Skies · Post by **Northern Skies** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 6:06 pm

sstaurus wrote:I bet those Culp Special's aren't cheap, but Wow.

You know, I think it would be cheaper to build than a skybolt. And that isn't much different than a two seat pitts. The same guy designed the thing! I think you can get an M14P and prop much cheaper than an AEIO-360. The extra fuel burn will balance that out pretty quick.

Aside from cost being an issue, scratch building an airplane is an incredible amount of work. Take a 3000 hour quoted build time and spread it over every sunday afternoon. That's a lot of sundays! Then multiply that for every time you run into a snag or can't decide how to go about something. Factor in the time spent sweeping up the shop, building jigs and bucks, waiting for dope to dry, consulting plans and AC43.13, and generally stopping to think things through. Some of the things that you think will be hard are a breeze, rib stitching a pitts ultimate top wing by myself took a day and a half! But other things will bite you in the ass, like assembling and rigging the airframe for the pre-cover inspection, just to take it all apart again. It's a pretty intense project.

In general, that's why there is often a distinction between builders and pilots. All too often someone gets into a project impatient to fly the thing, and ends up selling the project.

Northern Skies · Post by **Northern Skies** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 6:26 pm

mcrit wrote: If you already have some aerobatic experience and tail dragger time think about heading straight into a Pitts S1. I've seen them for between $20K-$30K

saw one go for $17K

AZN 027 · Post by **AZN 027** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 2:39 pm

The words "cheap" and "airplane" don't go together.

rd1331 · Post by **rd1331** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 6:02 am

Ok relatively cheap.

Mostly want a 2 seater. I hear Pitts are an extremely hard airplane to fly? True?

Blue Side Down · Post by **Blue Side Down** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:26 am

No, they're not hard. They just do what you tell them to do, without ado; and some pilots are not exactly sure of what they want an airplane to do. The hardest part about flying the Pitts is the re-configuring your mental approach to flying.

Blue Side Down · Post by **Blue Side Down** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:30 am

Look into the S2A... it's like the B, but eats less gas and won't really do multiple vertical rolls.

bmc · Post by **bmc** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:33 am

What about Zlin's? Are they pricey?

Hapless · Post by **Hapless** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:34 pm

Best Bang for the buck overall! As good for aerobatics as the Clip wing cub.

http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/rv-4int.htm

or the Harmon version....

rd1331 · Post by **rd1331** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:36 pm

Has no one heard of the Acro Sport? Or are they just not very good. Just been doing some research and stumbled upon them.

Whats the engine in a S2A?

Blue Side Down · Post by **Blue Side Down** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:18 pm

200 horse in the 2A

The acrosport's are fair game, and do reasonably well- much better than some of the single wings mentioned like the Citabria. There just aren't a whole lot around.

Hedley · Post by **Hedley** » Thu Oct 25, 2007 9:14 am

Pitts are an extremely hard airplane to fly?

FWIW Pitts are extremely easy to fly - it's a LOT easier to fly aerobatics in a Pitts than a Decathlon or Citabria because of the higher rate of roll, lower stick forces, and better power-to-weight ratio.

A Pitts is a LOT harder to land than a Decathlon or Citabria, though - it touches down MUCH faster, is shorter coupled, and has no forward vis - very much pre-WWII config.

A Pitts will kill you if you allow an "interesting" spin to develop - often out of a botched hammerhead or immelman. You can recover from the "interesting" spin, but sometimes people don't when they experience them for the first time by themselves. Personally, I find the accelerated inverted the wildest, and the inverted flat the tamest, though the inverted upright needs mentioning as probably the sneakiest because of the rudder blanking.

So, to learn to fly a Pitts, you need to learn how to land it, and learn how to unspin it.

Blue Side Down · Post by **Blue Side Down** » Thu Oct 25, 2007 10:05 am

Hedley wrote:though the inverted upright needs mentioning as probably the sneakiest because of the rudder blanking.

How do you manage to do that trick?