Flight college:Too late?

[armowings]

Hello all and happy new year!
I am currently in cegep in quebec in an unrelated aviation field and meanwhile i am doing my flight training, already half way through my commercial.
I am seeking advice please.
I read that aviation college degrees are considered higher than regular TC licenses.
FROM AIR CANADA WEBSITE:
University degree or college diploma
Aviation College diploma <--------
Military or commercial flight experience
Jet and/or glass cockpit experience
Additional language(s)
Since i am in my last cegep semester, i would like to know which step to take next. Should i go to a flight college (ie: Moncton) and finish the next half of my flying license, so i can get an aviation diploma at the end? or should i attend university and continue in the unrelated field so that i can become an instructor meanwhile and log my hours eventually so i can reach Air Canada. Which way will bring me closer to the interview with AC?
Thanks

[hairdo]

If you're already working towards a college diploma, then I wouldn't worry about getting an "aviation diploma." Really, the only difference is that you are doing the college and flying parts in a combined course, and that the college part is somewhat related to aviation. I personally got the aviation diploma, simply because I wanted some post-secondary education for the resume without having to do a separate course. Remember, that same AC website has uni degree or 'regular' college diploma on there as well. They just want to see that you are dedicated enough to do the extra work for a degree or diploma, aviation or not.

Regardless, AC is not going to take you directly out of college or flight school, diploma/degree or no. Nor are they very likely to hire someone who has only flown light training aircraft (not saying at all that you shouldn't instruct). But in the end, it's the journey that counts the most, not the final destination.

Whatever you choose, best of luck.

[just curious]

Ca ne vaut pas la peine de changer ton program a cette instant. Vaut mieux de continuer, pis completer ton bacelaureate. Comme ca tu auras les deux:University degree or college diploma au meme temps que tu commence comme instructeur.

[Embraer190]

To start, don't limit yourself to Air Canada. If you want to stay in Quebec there are other options like Air Transat. There are too many people who think the ultimate job is at Air Canada, which is untrue. Just curious's advice is good as any; finish school and become and instructor (or a bush pilot)... build up your hours and take it from there. The truth is, this no Air Canada pilot mold, they hire all kinds of pilots with all kinds of backgrounds.

Bonne chance.

[monkeyspankmasterflex]

http://www.cegep-chicoutimi.qc.ca/

Je pense que c'est pas mal subventionné.

[E-Flyer]

To start, don't limit yourself to Air Canada. If you want to stay in Quebec there are other options like Air Transat. There are too many people who think the ultimate job is at Air Canada, which is untrue. Just curious's advice is good as any; finish school and become and instructor (or a bush pilot)... build up your hours and take it from there. The truth is, this no Air Canada pilot mold, they hire all kinds of pilots with all kinds of backgrounds.

Bonne chance.

You and I think alike.

What's the deal with Air Canada, if it wasn't for flying a 67 which they'll retire anyway, I wouldn't send a resume to ACA; who's to say I'd even get on that type. Their requirements are too biased surrounding elements that don't all equate to the main objective they should be looking for; safe and proficient pilot's. I am still trying to figure out what the benefits of a degree in basket weaving are when it comes to flying...

Armowings, I'll tell you right now, if you are bi-lingual (with your second or first language being french) and have a degree, that will earn you more points with Air Canada. How long will it take to get to that step in your life? Depends on where you are, at what time, and who you know. But if you ask me, set your goal for West Jet and Air Transat. The general impression I get when talking to pilot's who have worked for all three, West, AirC, and AirT is that they enjoyed the warmer and more welcome feeling of the other two carriers of our nation.

But if your goal has been to fly for Air Canada, then by all means; strive for it, but also know that you're missing out on some potentially great jobs. And with the attitude of "how long does it take to ACA," you will not enjoy the ride a long, and all you would most likely be doing is going from job 1 to job 2 and look for the hours in comparison to the friend/companionship of other fellow aviators and the experience which is typically what take you far in aviation; many times "it's about who you know" and having "diverse" experiences that get you hired with an airline despite your hours. No degree needed.


Good luck with your decision.

[Embraer190]

You and I think alike.

What's the deal with Air Canada, if it wasn't for flying a 67 which they'll retire anyway, I wouldn't send a resume to ACA; who's to say I'd even get on that type. Their requirements are too biased surrounding elements that don't all equate to the main objective they should be looking for; safe and proficient pilot's. I am still trying to figure out what the benefits of a degree in basket weaving are when it comes to flying...

Armowings, I'll tell you right now, if you are bi-lingual (with your second or first language being french) and have a degree, that will earn you more points with Air Canada. How long will it take to get to that step in your life? Depends on where you are, at what time, and who you know. But if you ask me, set your goal for West Jet and Air Transat. The general impression I get when talking to pilot's who have worked for all three, West, AirC, and AirT is that they enjoyed the warmer and more welcome feeling of the other two carriers of our nation.

But if your goal has been to fly for Air Canada, then by all means; strive for it, but also know that you're missing out on some potentially great jobs. And with the attitude of "how long does it take to ACA," you will not enjoy the ride a long, and all you would most likely be doing is going from job 1 to job 2 and look for the hours in comparison to the friend/companionship of other fellow aviators and the experience which is typically what take you far in aviation; many times "it's about who you know" and having "diverse" experiences that get you hired with an airline despite your hours. No degree needed.


Good luck with your decision.

+1

[pilotguyCANADA]

I havent graduated yet from aviation college, but youre not too late bud. Obviously, if Guy A has 1000hrs total time, multi-time, whatever, and Guy B has the exact same; the guy with a diploma will be hired first. It is a plus def. to get a diploma AND connections are key just like anything in life, if you can somehow make friends with even the lowest guy at AC - thats something YOU have over the next guy.

Just keep working hard, studying, getting hours, Ill see u in the skies!!

[E-Flyer]

I havent graduated yet from aviation college, but youre not too late bud. Obviously, if Guy A has 1000hrs total time, multi-time, whatever, and Guy B has the exact same; the guy with a diploma will be hired first. It is a plus def. to get a diploma AND connections are key just like anything in life, if you can somehow make friends with even the lowest guy at AC - thats something YOU have over the next guy.

Just keep working hard, studying, getting hours, Ill see u in the skies!!

I dont' think you know what you're talking about there... it's not simply diplomas that cause an airline to hire you. If you're a person who has the prestige level of a "post-secondary graduate" and has diverse experiences, and have inside connections, you are more likely to get on. Remember, we're here to fly and not to brag about our 2.0 GPA we grabbed when we graduated.

And typically speaking, because college graduates generally think they're better, they screw up interviews because of a sense of self-praise and cockiness. If you truly think you're a better candidate than somebody with no degree, I wish you good luck in this industry. That degree will do as much as squat in a few years when the industry picks back up to a hiring spree. I don't mean to be rude, but our last rush with the hiring season proved that.

I'm doing my degree as well, but for other reasons - cause I like to get educated about the field I am working in. I started flying when I was 14, and grabbed my CPL when I was 18. I graduated last summer, and am doing an Aviation Degree right now. So I should feel better than you then cause I have am getting a degree and you are getting a diploma ... I don't. We're two pilot's with equal opportunities. Our attitude, luck, and desire is what will alter our path in this unstable industry.

[pilotguyCANADA]

e-flyer...do you work for an airline or flight school? I would think that any post-secondary education is better than not. It's crazy to say that it barely matters in trying to get a job. You said college/university grads are cockier or whatever, but I don't think so. It's the people like you who have been flying since you were 14 that think they are amazing pilots. I said side to side, I think an employer would take a diploma/degree with the SAME experiance in and out of the field, hours, etc. Yes and I did say networking is almost better than other things. If you know someone, that helps out much much more.

[E-Flyer]

It's the people like you who have been flying since you were 14 that think they are amazing pilots.

Wrong again; that's just your preconceived imagination telling you that. If I thought I was such an amazing pilot I wouldn't even bothered talking to you.. after all you would have been a bad pilot since I am an amazing one right?? come on now man. That's not at all what I was coming across.

I believe that just like every other pilot on this planet, I am a student for life. Where ever I go I will be back in the class room after some time to study new material or refresh what I know. Those airline guys are back in the class for GS and have line checks and have sim evals every 6 months (Typically). You will never be proficient at flying to the point where you don't need a refresher. You will always need to review and have an understanding of your physical organism, which in this case would be your aircraft.

It's crazy to say that it barely matters in trying to get a job.

No, it's not. If the industry is in a hiring spree, having a degree or not having a degree will not matter to the extent that you imply; if an airline needs to constantly fill up their roster like the case was in the past few years, the degree would be of small importance. Do you know the issue these days is to find an experienced pilot? rather than an educated one?

I think an employer would take a diploma/degree with the SAME experiance in and out of the field

Not if the attitude of the two candidates were different. The guys interviewing are typically fond individuals who have experience in how to determine what kind of person you are and how you would reflect the company; you don't need a degree to certify that. You should be an individual who should be able to certify that by being who you are because sooner or later, your personality will come out when you go to work. The degree won't be a deciding factor when/if they decide to let you go one day. If the degree won't be the reason for you to keep your job over some other guy, then it would most definitely not be the reason you get a job when comparing two candidates. Remember, we're not speaking of Air Canada here ...

As I said before, I am also doing my degree, but not for better job opportunities. I am doing the degree because I want to be educated in what I am partaking as my career. I would not want to have an airline hire me over some other guy because I simply had a degree; because I would underestimate if the airline really valued the the other qualifications... you see where I am going with this? You should be able to prove to the airline when in person that you are worthy of the job. IF you have an interview with an airline, that means you are a potential candidate. Degree or no degree. It's those 45 minutes, your medical, sim, apt tests, etc that will reflect your position in the pool when the judgment day comes along !

If you think about it, why would a 5000 hour pilot with good kinds of flight time not get an interview? Are you and i debating about the 1500 hour guy who applies with a degree and a 1500 hour guy who applies with no degree?... cause in that case... what's the big rush to get to the airlines anyway.

No, I don't fly for the airlines; however, I've been blessed to know many that do fly for them and have been more than kind introducing me to many more which leads to a better idea of how the route of getting there works ! There are a bunch of ways ! And I am simply afraid that if you simply think that your degree will be the reason you will fly for an airline, you will be dissapointed one day... I'd hate that to happen for you pilotguy. You seem like a nice individual who is working hard for your passion to fly.

[Hedley]

It's the people like you who have been flying since you were 14 ...

Frankly, 14 years old is not too young to learn to fly. Many
tasks are better learned at an early age. I can't remember
when I started flying - I can't remember that far back into
my childhood.

Similarly, I started my son flying as soon as he could
reach the flight controls, with the help of cushions to
lift him up, and forward to reach the rudder pedals.

By the time he was 14, he was solo on our (tailwheel)
Maule, and by the time he turned 16 he had 250+ tailwheel
hours in his logbook, and he was solo on our Pitts, which
only a handful of pilots in Canada are capable of landing -
unless you have significant experience in pre-WWII aircraft,
or WWII fighters, most people find it quite humbling.

Anyways, I digress. Flying, like many other skills, is best
learned at an early age. Reminds me of that famous
basketball player that decided to learn how to play pro
basefall - and he couldn't

I doubt anyone has ever heard of the incredible
Freddie Spencer, who is one of the fastest motorcycle
racers of the 20th century:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freddie_Spencer

a racing prodigy who began racing at the age of four

That's right, FOUR years old. He was signed by Honda
to their factory superbike racing tean when he was 17
years old, and was still in high school.

And I doubt anyone here has ever heard of Nicky Hayden,
MotoGP champion in 2006, either:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicky_Hayden

As a youth, racing others twice his age in CMRA, Hayden would often start the race from the back of the starting grid while a family or crew member held his bike upright because he could not touch the ground. Later, at age 17, he was racing factory Honda RC45 superbikes while still in high school

[E-Flyer]

It's the people like you who have been flying since you were 14 ...

Frankly, 14 years old is not too young to learn to fly. Many
tasks are better learned at an early age. I can't remember
when I started flying - I can't remember that far back into
my childhood.

Similarly, I started my son flying as soon as he could
reach the flight controls, with the help of cushions to
lift him up, and forward to reach the rudder pedals.

By the time he was 14, he was solo on our (tailwheel)
Maule, and by the time he turned 16 he had 250+ tailwheel
hours in his logbook, and he was solo on our Pitts, which
only a handful of pilots in Canada are capable of landing -
unless you have significant experience in pre-WWII aircraft,
or WWII fighters, most people find it quite humbling.

Anyways, I digress. Flying, like many other skills, is best
learned at an early age. Reminds me of that famous
basketball player that decided to learn how to play pro
basefall - and he couldn't

I doubt anyone has ever heard of the incredible
Freddie Spencer, who is one of the fastest motorcycle
racers of the 20th century:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freddie_Spencer

a racing prodigy who began racing at the age of four

That's right, FOUR years old. He was signed by Honda
to their factory superbike racing tean when he was 17
years old, and was still in high school.

And I doubt anyone here has ever heard of Nicky Hayden,
MotoGP champion in 2006, either:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicky_Hayden

As a youth, racing others twice his age in CMRA, Hayden would often start the race from the back of the starting grid while a family or crew member held his bike upright because he could not touch the ground. Later, at age 17, he was racing factory Honda RC45 superbikes while still in high school

There you go ...

The younger you start something and continue with it, the most likely you are to excel at it.

If you look back to most pro hockey players for example, they started at a very young age.

I just had that feeling like I knew what I was going to do when I was young so I took advantage of the low age requirements to get my certifications. Whether I'm a good pilot or bad pilot, I can't let my ego decide that .... let's leave that up to the people with standards who grade pilot's at the appropriate times in their career since all of us think we're good pilots ... just like none of us believe our driving is bad... well technically if you don't abide to the speed limit, you're a bad driver. That probably makes up about the entire population of pilots

Pilotguy, I really wish you the best dude