flying fireman cansoC-GFFJ

[sonny covin]

Would anyone like to know some of the history of canso C-GFFJ. That would be after it left Alaska for Sydney to go with the flying fireman, and subsequent flights.

[X Driver]

Sure lets hear about FFC. Are you still working as a fishing guide out of CYBL??

[Cat Driver]

FFC spent years in Moses Lake and was bought at an auction by Buffalo Joe. It went to Red Deer and was finally sold to a guy in Maine where it is now located.

[HS-748 2A]

748 Reserving this space. I have an article I will contribute here soon.

[Flybabe]

We're all waiting with baited breath

[xsbank]

What do you bait your breath with? Anchovies? Herring? Then again, what do you hope to catch? I am really interested.

[Cat Driver]

Xsbank my understanding of the phrase " bated / baited breath " is the silence between when they change from grunting to moaning.

[Flybabe]

I could be so lucky - on either account

[X Driver]

We are waiting for the story Sonny have they only limited internet down on the rock??

[sonny covin]

I posted a few paragraphs with regards to C-GFFJ that when It came from Alaska on the way to Sydney the accmulator blew a two foot hole on the side of the fuselage. When Mike Pearson , chief pilot for the Flying Fireman, Ray Simcoe Captain on FFJ and myself were training on lake cowichan, Ray came in too slow to to pick up a load and to prove a point Mike Pearson selected probe down to show him how difficult it is at this speed, when all hell broke loose.
The aircraft went into a violent water loop and since I was directly behind the bulkhead aft of the pilot seat, I was thrown up against the right side of the A/C, the right wing sort of doug into the water but all in all the plane was ok, except after we beach the plane we noticed that the right bomb door had opened up on probe down selection. Now as all PBY pilots know bomb doors should not open because they have a geometric locking system, in laymans terms an over centre locking device. In other words we need hyd. pressure to open the doors.

The mechanics were called to fix the problem and after a few hours drive showed up with a 1 1/2 ton come along a wajax pump to get some water out, "canso"s really leak when sitting in the water" and then we got off the lake as shallow a climb as possible due to water at rear of the airplane was flowing back and causing a tail heavy situation. A week later the A/C was repaired and Ray and I were on our way to Dryden.

The next post I submitted was on June 1st and I talked about a fire north west of Kenora, and some where after a dozen pickups we had filled up the bomb tanks for another run but we couldn`t get off the water. The probes were selected up but remained in the down position. Tanker #9 was equipped with two probes and with them down we couldn`t leave the lake. Although we had two 2600 Wright engines and 1200 gallons of water we were not able to get off the lake.
So we beached the A/C with wheels down and I removed the hyd. line connection, dove under water and pounded the probe up with a 5Lb. short handle sledge and needless to say we had lots of fluid all over the place. With the probes back up and gear up I fastened the probe mechanism with some rope we had for anchoring and replaced the hyd. connection. Ray cycle the doors so the water would seek its own level and again shallow take off climb and headed to Dryden. Our two probes were now reduced to one and before we could picked up 1200 galons of water in 12 to 15 sec. the one probe system increased our loading time to appx. 20 sec. So with the problems we were having lake sizes were now an issue.

Next more hyd. problems, rpms that tweek upwards when they should go down, feathering props and crunched up vans.

sonny

[Cat Driver]

Any idea why the doors opened on tanker 9 causing it to crash?

Or did something else cause it?

[sonny covin]

We were having lots of problems with the doors. Sometimes we would do our external checks and the doors would be closed but the light in the cockpit would be on. So when we were in flight Ray or myself would cycle the doors and the light would go out. Our first guess was that the micro switch wasn't making contact with the tab which was attached to the torque tubes. At times when the probe or the gear was selected to the down position the accumulator pressure would drop from 500 Lbs. to zero and then back to 500Lbs. I found this unsual because the system is set up for dampening surge pressure or any drop in Hyd. pressure.

Well anyway weeks would go buy without anything happening then were back to more door cycling and the accumulator showing big pressure drops. On a practice at sandy beach lake all five cansos were present when on a climb after doing a pickup Ray was bringing the throttles back to climb power when I noticed the rpm do a small rise on the right engine rpm gauge. I told Ray the situation and I mentioned that we might have blown a jug in thr right engine. He pushed the throttles back to take off power and then back to climb power. It did the same thing. So we dropped our load picked up three undred feet real quick and shut down the engine and feathered the prop. I called Kenora radio to let them know we were on our way back to Dryden inbount in 15 min. The controller asked if the other A/C were also comming and my reply was no they were no fun to play with anymore.

Upon landing at Dryden airport, we used the left engine to make a right turn off the runway and when we tried to turn left to go to our maintenance shack we couldn't turn. Ray tried to brake to no avail. He was yelling to anyone that could hear to throw a chalk in front the left main gear but no one heard. So we kept on rolling into a MNR white van parked in front of the communication tower, not very fast mind you but fast enough to do a write off job. . This was a god send because we would have destroyed the tower. The problem was that the right engine hyd. motor was not working due to the shut down engine and the left one was operational but we had a busted hyd. line in the bomb compartment which we found out later.

This happened two weeks before the fatal day of July 12 1982 7:00 pm

On July the 12th 1982, Ray Simcoe and I were dispatched to a fire North Sioux Lookout with the MNR single otter. Bill Wiedenhoff was our bird dog officer at the drop area. That day was my turn to fly left seat. Ray would let me fly as capt. Every second trip as did Larry Rollof the following year. The closest lake to the fire was Jackson Lake appx. 400 yards wide and one to two miles long. On arrival at the lake, there were ripples of 4 to 5 inches high, with a light wind straight down the lake. It took us appx. 20 minutes for a complete rounder give or take a few minutes.

After 4 hrs. of flying, Bill suggested we head for Sioux Lookout to get some lunch and top up with fuel. It was after 3 pm when we left to return to the fire. After doing another 15 or so loads I was on approach to the lake touched down on the water, added power and told Ray to select probe down. Just then the aircraft nose dived so violently that the nose section of the airplane went totally under water and the next thing I knew I was at the bottom of the lake strapped in my seat facing the bottom. I undid my harness and swam up, 20 or so feet to the surface. What I saw was just unbelievable. There was debris all over the place any paper we had in the A/C was floating the orange sleeping bags we were issued were floating away as did the tail section. I started to cry out for Ray to no avail, I looked around and saw the wings were vertical, those 2600 wright engines are pretty heavy. The fuel caps were popped off and fuel spewing out of the tanks.

In the mean time I was still screaming for Ray and what seemed like forever he finally comes out of the water and yells “I can’t swim” he was about forty feet away and I swam over as fast as I could and grabbed him under the arm and chest. We started to swim towards the wings, which were the only thing close to us, Ray was having trouble breathing he was so heavy and struggling to stay afloat. I told him to kick as hard as he could since I was having a terrible time trying to get us to the wings. Finally we were about 15 or so feet away when Ray just seems to give up were both crying by this point he was hurting so bad and swallowing water and growing weaker by the second.

The next thing he just seems to give up and we both start to go under. I got a breath of air before we went under and then Ray has a grip on my left leg and I get my right leg between his shoulder blades and pushed as hard as I could. At that moment I though “ I love you Ray but I can’t go with you.” Ray came off with my sock and shoe. I must say here that a few days earlier I had bought tube socks instead of sport socks and the tube socks went all the way up to the top of my calf muscle. I suspect that Ray’s death grip was lessened by the socks sliding off my leg. We were only maybe three feet below the surface of the lake. After getting another breath of air I look down and Ray’s khaki shirt, which he never buttons up was floating a foot or so below the surface. I grab it and Ray comes up to the surface, he must have had enough air in his lungs to sustain him at that level.

Well this time I grabbed him under the chin and I was headed towards the wings which were much lower now when I saw the nose section bob up about 3 feet out of the water. It was around 40 feet away so I headed for it. I found a hand hold and pushed Ray’s head against it and gave him 15 to 20 breaths of air. He then coughs out water and then takes a huge breath and coughs up more water and that was the greatest thing I have ever witness. I had saved my brother Joel’s life from drowning when he was 5. I was 15 at the time and my brother Dennis also ten yrs. younger was watching, but this, the elation was incredible. I guess as kids we don’t realize the importance of the things we do but this really hit home. While we were straddling the nose section, the single otter was on final for its pickup, when he was even with us about 150 feet away he looks at us and then carries on with his pickup. On arrival at the fire Bill Wiedenhoff asked where are Sonny and Ray? He says “ they put down on the lake.”

These words were told to me by Bill Wiedenhoff the next day. I would have to assume here that our crashing did not register here. The tail section was floating away after it broke off from the fuselage and by this time the wings had gone down to the bottom. By the time Bill showed up about 15 min. later the wings had gone down and only debris and the tail were floating away. Bill's pilot brought the turbo beaver next to the nose section and none too soon we only had about a foot of the nose section sticking out of the water by now. We had a hell of a time to get Ray into the airplane the beaver having longer struts being a turbo prop made it that much harder to get him in. Ray weight over 235 lb. dry weight and dead weight made it very difficult. Ray spent a week in the Dryden hospital, he had a lot of bruises and 3 or 4 broken ribs which is why he couldn’t breathe very well or kick his feet. I on the other hand didn’t have a scratch.

Two days later I got a hold of a local scuba diver in Dryden and we put together 8, 72 cu. ft. Bottles and whatever we needed for a day’s dive on the wreck. We borrowed a boat and latched it on to the single otter that Bill had authorised to take us up there. The wreck was not hard to find, we had an oil slick showing the way. We unloaded the stuff in the boat and told the pilot to pick us up in 6 to 8 hours. The lake was about 25 ft. deep plus silt we needed lights down there it was pretty dark, when I saw the bomb doors all bent up and twisted I knew why the violent nose dive. The cockpit had been cut aft of the pilot bulkhead by the prop I would assume when the prop hit the water and the shaft broke off then slicing off part of the cockpit which then snapped off saving our lives. I found Ray’s duffle bag, it was all chopped up, he usually kept it behind the left seat aft of the bulkhead.

When I found the nose section about 40 feet from the cabin section the captain seat was still there attached and my david clarke headset was still plugged in, and I still have them to this day. The seat I brought back to the MNR at Dryden and told them I’d be back for it, but someone got to it first. Ray and I stayed in around for another week and then headed for YBL. He then came back to Kavanah, Alberta where he lived. I now live in Leduc, AB. just a few miles north of Kavanah.
In Sept of 1982 Mike Pearson called me in YBL and asked if I wanted to go to High Level Ab. with Bill Heinz, they had a big fire up there and needed some bombers, I said yes, so he came to pick me up with the birddog 337 and let me fly it back to Sydney. Bill Heinz and I left for High Level that afternoon, and the first time we did a pickup my pucker factor was enabled. Bill Heinz being an awesome canso pilot and professional made my transition after the crash bearable and then became fun again. He actually put the “fun” back in funeral, lol.

We were there for two weeks and then back to Sydney with Mike flying me back to YBL. I was very sad to hear of Mike`s passing. He taught me a lot about flying 337`s and cansos as did Ray and Larry Rollof. To me they were the greats in the Industry. The next two years Ray Simcoe went flying on trackers with the Sask. Gov. and I believe he retired the year after that. I on the other hand went flying with Larry Rollof and the following year on Mitchell B 25`s in Fort Smith for one season and then I went to teach physics and chemistry at portage college in Lac La Biche Ab. About ten years ago I was sad to hear of Ray's passing we had kept in touch two or three times a month, his health was failing and he spent quite a bit of time down south where his children lived.

About five years after the crash I got a call from Bill Wiedenhoff to go fly right seat on the 215, this was in late July. I told him I didn’t have an ATR, he told me to get it and call him when I’m done. Three weeks and 6,000 dollars later I got my class 1 back and called Bill, the delay was due to scheduling at the airport. Bill said that since it was getting too close to end of the season to stay in touch with him next spring, but politics played an important part in Ontario and the Gov. put a hold on hiring and used beaver and otter pilots as co-jo’s and I was out of a job. Bill wiedenhoff is now retired from the MNR and still lives in Dryden Ont.

Leaving flying has always been a sore spot in my life and I now live my flying vicariously through programs like FLIGHTPATH and JETSTREAM. and watching Micheal McLear's programs on old war birds, beavers, canso's and the like. I thought of going back to flying helicopters but the cost now is just too expensive.

I have a question, would anyone know where Alexander Linkewich would be these days? He autographed his book that he gave me back in 1984 and I sure enjoyed reading it.

Thanks for this forum AVCANADA it’s like getting free therapy. Also if Milos Viche is around we are having a Flying Fireman reunion on Oct 24th @ Sydney Museum and Derwyn Ross is looking after it. Please Call Sonny Covin at 780 222 1850 or Derwyn at 1 250 514 6598 for more info.

[sonny covin]

In answer to your question, my best guess is, being as the doors were a drop type system maybe the bushings on the torque tubes were worn, pins in the hyd. jack system were worn this could have caused the geometric system to not work properly. We must remember that this system works best with water in the tank. Then we have pressure on the over centre portion of the locking system. With the microswitch sometimes not making contact with the tab on the torque tube to indicate that the doors are closed tight, pushing the tab closer to the microswitch is not going to fix the problem. Perhaps we have an alignment problem? Also is it normal to have a 500 lb. drop in the system when the probe is selected down, or when the gear is selected down. In our case, should there be more than 500 psi pressure on the top side of that accumulator? Was the accumulator filled to the high mark? Those who know the system can answere these questions.

[Cat Driver]

I have a vague idea of how the system works and your scenario is possible but unlikely.

One of the real traps was in the way the Flying Fireman had their push buttons arranged on the wheel. The transmit button for the radio/ intercom was right beside the bomb door activation button.

We had a couple of door opening events in the water when the Captain pushed the wrong button to ask for probe down and hit the door open button...and the door system was armed.

[sonny covin]

I agree there were some A/C that were set up like that but FFJ had a safety lock so that wouldn't occur. We had to lift the guard first.
sonny

[X Driver]

Here are your pictures Sonny you will have to put a post below if you want to add any text.

[X Driver]

Her are a couple more I have come across over the years, the paint stripped one is an ex Buffalo machine I believe sitting down in Arizona, the four engine machine is Dr Birds in Spokane Wash.

[sonny covin]

Here are your pictures Sonny you will have to put a post below if you want to add any text.
Tanker #4 doing pickup on Kenora fire.
I did an exhibition jump on Canada Day at Dryden Ont.
Tanker 3 doing drop on Kenora Fire.
This was part of the Kenora Fire which actually started as a prescribed burn.
Going home after a long day of flying.

This is Jackson Lake where tanker 9 lies at rhe bottom July 12 1982.

[Cat Driver]

Ahhh I remember when we got tanker 4 it was one of two PBY6A's that Moose bought in 1974 from France.

I think the registrations were CF-HNH and CF-HNR, we did an annual on HNH in North Weald just north of London England about five or six years ago.

It is now in Israel.

[sonny covin]

I skydived out of it in Dryden one year. Just open that bubble and roll out.

[HS-748 2A]

Sorry about all that

baiting and waiting

but I have had a very prosperous summer and have not had a chance to make good.

Here is the article:

[HS-748 2A]

.

[c_172pilot]

Sonny thanks for that, I can’t imagine what flying those magnificent machines back then must have been like. I have flown a lot off of Cowichan Lake and crawled all over the wrecked canso in Tofino but it has never been as clear as when you describe it. Your writing is really excellent, you should publish that!

Cheers

c_172pilot

[CLguy]

About five years after the crash I got a call from Bill Wiedenhoff to go fly right seat on the 215, this was in late July. I told him I didn’t have an ATR, he told me to get it and call him when I’m done. Three weeks and 6,000 dollars later I got my class 1 back and called Bill, the delay was due to scheduling at the airport. Bill said that since it was getting too close to end of the season to stay in touch with him next spring, but politics played an important part in Ontario and the Gov. put a hold on hiring and used beaver and otter pilots as co-jo’s and I was out of a job.

Sonny it is too bad you wasted the $6,000 dollars as I suspect someone was blowing a bit of smoke up your ass because Bill never ever had anything to do with hiring pilots. While you were there he was an Air Attack Leader and that was it. Why he would have lead you to believe he actually had the authority to hire you is beyond me.

Great to hear your story first hand as I have heard it told many times over the years but usually by people who heard it from someone else. No doubt must have been a hell of a ride! The beaver pilot that picked you up was Larry Britton and he also passed away from cancer in the late 90's.

I had the pleasure of crewing with Larry Roluf as well in 1984 in an Avalon Aviation Canso, Tanker 2, C-FGLX. I had never learned so much from one man before or since. He was a class act all the way! He passed away about 6 years ago well up in his 90's. I had seen him a couple of times over the years but his mind went and he ended up wasting away in a seniors home in Gravenhurst, Ontario for quite a few years. If there was ever a book that needed written it was of his aviation career. I used to sit in awe listening to his stories that covered everything from flying Tiger Moths in Red Lake, Norseman's in the Arctic, to training pilots in Africa and the Middle East to exploring the remote islands of Indonesia in a PBY.

I also flew PBY C-FFFZ with Milos Vich as the captain for the Flying Fireman so these stories are bringing back lots of memories. Some good and some not so good!

Thanks again!

[Chuck Ellsworth]

If they came any better than Larry I never met them.

Larry went to Canadair after he left Avalon and as far as I know stayed there until he retired.