PDM... something is wrong

[MAD DOGGY]

I'm generally a side-liner on this forum, but I saw something tonight that made me go hmmm and wow at the same time. I don't have much involvement with the general aviation community but lately I've been doing a little night flying. Here's the story...
I met a local guy (doctor) who told me he had 400hrs TT and had just bought a Found on amphibs. He has less than 30hrs I guess on the plane. I watch him land on wheels at the airport taxi in, unload, and then fire-up again. It is now 10 mins after legal dark as I BS to some great old guy. The Found pilot lifts off again in the direction of his cottage; at least 20nm away. The other guy I'm with just shakes his head. The worst part is , he not only goes there,but doesn't park it for the night!!! He comes back again to the airport. Meaning a take-off in total dark from the water. I saw the first group of family or friends, I assume the second trip was more people or they just forgot the dog. WTFO... Same direction in reverse out and back, towards said lake and not enough time or the right direction to the closest airport.
I must be missing something, where you can blatantly break a ton of rules and put peoples lives at risk, with limited experience and feel good about it. There has been alot of small private planes having mishaps, and now I wonder why... Apparently another local guy did the same thing early in the summer and clipped a dock with his amphib beaver and destroyed it. Luckily no fatalities. He's still flying with a new/old Beaver.
Maybe I'm out to lunch and someone will put me in my place. Cheers, MD.

[modi13]

Don't hesitate to report flagrant rule breaking. Even if you're not sure whether they've done anything wrong, it won't hurt to contact TC; if what they're doing is legal, they won't get in trouble. Gather more evidence, if need be, but make sure something is done. That kind of behaviour is why people die.

[planett]

Many sucessful people got that way by being pushy, or hard headed, or clever about interpretations. Don't expect them to change when taking up a hobby like flying, especially when it is largely understood to be "just like driving". After all, they completed Medical School, MBA, PhD etc., how hard could this be?

Risks in aviation are often far too subtle to be detected and appreciated in the first 500, 1000, or 5000 hours.

[jeffider]

http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/s ... s-menu.htm

Report to the CAIRS - it does get some attention at a faster rate.

[The Old Fogducker]

So, where are the guys who would have you do nothing?

"Turning in" a fellow aviator to the dastardly DOT for their action is considered by some to be "ratting out a buddy."

I've dealt with this several times in my career, and have never hesitated about doing something about it ... whether it was to take the fella out behind the hangar for a little one-on-one chat, firing the tool and not giving a recommendation, or turning the guy in to Transport for further action. The degree of response was determined by the amount of force required to effect behaviour modification and a guarantee of future compliance.

Generally, I have been disappointed by Transport's action, or lack of it on the times I've referred something to Enforcement. My personal view is that some serious stuff seems to escape a healthy fine or suspension, and I don't expect it will be any different in "the new era" that TC is entering.

They are becoming too concerned with being perceived as "good guys" because some sleazebag operator complains to his MP about TC doing their jobs.

They want to be seen as a "kinder, gentler Transport Canada" I guess.

The Old Fogducker

[AME 283]

Unless it is a SMS company chances TC will not do anything about it, they have very little interest in GA, as far as the CAIRs system, good luck getting a response

Club TC needs a major overhaul

[ScudRunner]

few quick questions.

-Do you know for certain where he landed (witnessed it, hearsay is inadmissible) ?
-Was the airstrip where he landed controlled or monitored in anyway?
-Is the airstrip lighted for Night flying?

The problem if the airport is uncontrolled their will be no official record of the flight other than his AC Journey log, if he was dumb enough to enter the correct up and down times wich I don't think is a requirement for private aircraft anymore (correct me if i'm wrong) is the only way this infraction will stick. (hanging himself)

Now if the Airstrip is unlit you are a witness to the fact he departed at XX:XX o'clock. So if you and the old guy swear on the Koran or a box of corn flakes now TC has something to go on. (will you put it in writing?)

If as I suspect the airport is uncontrolled and no one saw him take off and land on the water at whatever o'clock and his logbook only shows he went flying out of this uncontrolled airport in his amphibious Found with the proper night VFR navigation equipment im sorry to say nothing will happen to this pilot.

If this guy hangs himself and has entered the flight as you describe it with correct up and down times and TC checks up on him he will only be assessed I would imagine a 2500 dollar fine at max and perhaps a licence suspension for no more than a week.

[midwingcrisis]

Remember......when ya Rat someone....ya gotta be really clean with those guys....caveat emptor!! You will always be lookin' over..careful now...je me souviens...

[Nark]

Thanks for proving the point midwingcrisis.


Would you call 911 and report a drunk driver? How about someone who has a child seat up front in the '04 Explorer?

I doubt you would hesitate to call the authorities if you directly saw a potential hazard to a child while driving. How is it different while flying?

It's good to know integrity isn't lost of a number of the members of this forum.

[The Old Fogducker]

Thanks for proving the point midwingcrisis.
........
It's good to know integrity isn't lost of a number of the members of this forum.

You're right on yet again Nark.

Integrity in aviation is alive and well ... in a scumbag federal prison sort of way ....after all, its "us" vs "The Screws." You'd know all about that code of conduct Nark. If you "rat somebody out," you can expect to be shanked in the shower stalls.

Midwing, just keep your head down and ignore everything you see going on around you.... after all, if it doesn't concern you directly, who the hell cares what other people do? Do you have a set of custom modified horse blinders that you wear when you are hanging out at the airport? Is your field of view limited to an area the size of a dime?

With this post, I'm not trying to call you out into some UFC fight ring sort of way, but to "de-influence" any readers that may be swayed by your flawed perspective.

Heaven forbid you should speak up, and maybe save somebody's life.....after all, that's someone else's responsibility isn't it?

The Old Fogducker

[MAD DOGGY]

Lighted runway in a class "E" control zone with an operating FSS. I'm no a-hole, love to fly for the window seat and love to shoot the shit with others about good times. I just don't want to hear about trips like this one, where unsuspecting individuals lives are put at risk . Further more, I'm sure BS like this, when it ends in tragedy or bent metal at minimum, costs everyone with higher insurance.
I'm still contemplating what to do... I'd rather meet him on the dark side of the hangar when his wife and kids aren't lookin' LOL. Cheers, MD.
To those who replied, thanks for confirming I'm not crazy, and that some form of professionalism has to be maintained no matter who you are in society.

[Dust Devil]

Ya I'd start by talking to the guy first. Who knows what is going on at the other end of the flight. Depending on the outcome of the conversation go to the authorities. At least then you can sleep knowing you did what you could.

[. ._]

Tell him to consider buying a Bonanza. (but only fly it solo)

[The Old Fogducker]

Actually, I'd suggest talking to him last, so you can figure out if he is bullshipping or not.

Talk to a few other people first and get their stories and compare them for content. Check any documentary evidence that might exist in the way of facilities maps, etc.

After you've got as feeling for what happened, ask him about it and compare his information to the other info you've previously obtained and then draw your conclusions as to your next action based on his conduct and honesty.

If all the stories line up, he is repentant or no untoward action took place, "then he walks." If he lies to you, and basically tells you to pee up a rope, then he deserves whatever he gets in the way of "the system" working to change his behaviour.

Some aviation miscreants reform wonderfully once confronted .... for others, its just the start of a lifetime of being on ... or outside of ...the edge.

The Old Fogducker

[Invertago]

Tell him to consider buying a Bonanza. (but only fly it solo)

Naw, he needs something with a chute, he's a Cirrus kinda guy.

[modi13]

Integrity in aviation is alive and well ... in a scumbag federal prison sort of way ....after all, its "us" vs "The Screws."

That's why you've got to shank someone on your first day.

[crankedup]

There has been alot of small private planes having mishaps, and now I wonder why... Apparently another local guy did the same thing early in the summer and clipped a dock with his amphib beaver and destroyed it. Luckily no fatalities. He's still flying with a new/old Beaver.

Destroyed the dock or the Beaver?