JAA Conversions...

mysidesdone · Post by **mysidesdone** » Tue Mar 09, 2004 11:58 am

Anybody else converting from Canadian ATPL to JAA?

107 · Post by **107** » Tue Mar 09, 2004 8:50 pm

Nothing I'd love more since the gf's moving to the UK this summer ... yeah yeah yeah I know ... but I'd still love to ... but like most people I realize one thing ... 14 exams and an IR test costs $$

Cheers!

popo · Post by **popo** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 9:35 am

mysidesdone,

Are you converting ? in which country?
I am thinking about it, but i have to find the cash first and then the time.

I would do it on line as i still have a flying job here in canada.

let us know what you are thinking!

mysidesdone · Post by **mysidesdone** » Thu Mar 11, 2004 11:32 am

Ive plunged in head first. ALthough started by studying on-line back in Canada, off and on for 6 months, I finally moved to England at Christmas. Even though I was intent on doing more from Canada, there is nothing like not getting a salary to motivate you to do things quickly.

Ive done the first 8 exams and will write 6 more in 3 weeks. Im still trying to work out what I need to do for the flying, I may not have to pay for any flying at all.

The studying is actually not that bad... although I had fun in Canada my last few months there, carreer wise, I sure wish I came here earlier.

P.S.
The only reason I would recommend some one to wait... it is way easier(and about $10000 cheaper) to make the switch with 500hours multi-crew. Make sure that the UK CAA blesses that MC time before you move... some A/C don't count.

wallypilot · Post by **wallypilot** » Fri Mar 12, 2004 5:41 pm

what school are you taking it through? Do you have a Cdn ATPL, or just CPL/IR? I am curious as to the estimated cost, as I would be intested in doing the conversion at some point in the next couple of years.

mysidesdone · Post by **mysidesdone** » Sun Mar 14, 2004 2:14 am

I have been going through Oxford. They have a fantastic ground school and a good reputation. If you are thinking of coming over here... Multi crew time is the big thing. If you can get 500hours multi crew, you will save big hassle and big $$$$!!

Captain Stinky · Post by **Captain Stinky** » Sun Mar 14, 2004 12:39 pm

What is the job market really like there for guys with good levels of experience but no jet time? For example, 4000 hours, 550 SIC on heavy multi-crew turboprop? Also, where do you find out if the plane you got the multi-crew experience on (Dash 7 in my case) is accepted by the CAA? I couldn't find it on their website.

Kosiw · Post by **Kosiw** » Sun Mar 14, 2004 12:50 pm

Hey Stink,

You tried TCA, they are/were, looking for Dash 7 drivers recently for some African contract.....or have you "been there, done that"?

mysidesdone · Post by **mysidesdone** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 2:04 am

Check out http://www.ppjn.com to get a good picture of the job market. Dash 7 time will be recognised as multicrew, but wont give you a waiver from the exams. 737 or larger and you don't need to write any to convert.

bubba070 · Post by **bubba070** » Tue Mar 16, 2004 8:41 pm

mysidesdone

I have just started to look into a conversion. You say you started to study online, could you tell me where I could look to get started.

cyyz · Post by **cyyz** » Wed Mar 17, 2004 9:00 am

http://www.oxfordaviation.net/jaa/groun ... nce_gs.htm

I believe this is the course he was doing(imo).

Naples also has an online course

http://www.nacgroundschool.com/index.php?id=394

Just an aside. If you buy the books 14(+/-) training manuals you'll be paying $1200US for them, but you'll be able to sell them afterwards. Unlike the $2200 pound Oxford course or $1500US Naples course.

Look them up at the Jeppesen site.

http://www.jeppesen.com/wlcs/applicatio ... _id=AT1C3O

blue_side_up · Post by **blue_side_up** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 7:31 am

Did my conversion a couple of yrs ago. I did Cdn Atpl to UK Atpl, now the UK issues JAR licenses, so req's are perhaps different.
Here's how I know it;
COSTS A BLOODY FORTUNE!!

But that said, was a good move, I know have a great job in Europe.
Conversion cost me about 15,000 pounds. I did it over 2yrs, bought the books, studied at home, went to the uk for a 'consolidation course' (3week review) just before writing the exams. Had to do 14 exams, got a waiver for one only (didn't have to do Morse Code!). Because of my ATPL, didn't have to do the approved groundschool course for the exams. Also had waiver on flying training - only had to do what the school I chose thought was necessary for me to pass the flight tests (that turned out to be about 8-9hrs for the commercial flt test, then about 9hrs twin and 15hrs sim for the multi-IFR). Got a waiver on the MCC (Multi-crew co-ordination) course as I had over 500hrs 2-crew in the King Air in Canada. I had to provide a letter from my chf plt though, that stated that by our ops manual, we had to ALWAYS operate the Be100 2-crew, even on positioning and ferry flights).
I suggest if u can get the groundschool wiaver, you do the studying at home, then take a consolidation course like I did. I think you can get the waiver if you have more than 700hrs TT. If you have to do the full, approved course, it takes 35-40weeks!!

The only way you will get a waiver on all (except for 2: Air Law and Human Factors) the written exams is if you have more than 1500hrs PIC on an a/c over 20,000KGS MTOW!
The UK CAA website is pretty useful, and they always answered my email queries pretty fast. http://www.srg.caa.co.uk
Good Luck!

blue_side_up · Post by **blue_side_up** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 7:43 am

One more comment...
Did my flight conversion training through a school called Stapleford Flying Club - http://www.flysfc.com Had a great experience there, their rates were pretty decent, and had good instructors. They were cheaper (by far) than somewhere like Oxford Air Training, but some people (and airlines too I suppose) want the Oxford name on their resume. That said though, the cost of renting a Cherokee or similar will blow you away when you compare to Canada! A PA-28 (with instructor) will knock you back about 175pounds/hr ($450 Cdn!!!!!

)
I did my correspondance gndschool through a company that has since gone bust, but I know Stapleford affiliates with London Guildhall University for their groundschool courses. I think LGU offers them via correspondance also.

airwrench · Post by **airwrench** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 8:43 am

Anyone know about converting An AME licence to JAA?

mysidesdone · Post by **mysidesdone** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 10:46 am

Blueside,

How was it after the conversion looking for work? Are you working in the UK now?

How long did it take to find a job? Did they have any trepidation when it came to your Canadian past?

MSD

wallypilot · Post by **wallypilot** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 3:49 pm

I am curious as well on the above question posed by MSD.

blue_side_up · Post by **blue_side_up** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 4:36 am

Mysidesdone, wallypilot:
I´m working in Europe now (for a European operator), will be at a UK base by this summer. It took me over a year to find work here since finishing my license, but I continued working in Canada during that time. No doubt I could´ve found work here sooner if I´d plunged in and moved right away. Pretty hard to leave a current job and move on speculation though. I had a couple of interviews before the one that got me my current job, and they were more intrigued (and perhaps amazed - NDB approaches?! Gravel strips?!

) by my Canadian experience than put off by it. I was often far far more experienced (at 2500hrs) than 80% of their other applicants, remember in Europe they´ll often hire directly into airlines from flight school!

Unheard of in Canada.
Their biggest concern seemed to be whether I might be inclined to leave and go back to Canada after getting a job. Worried about training costs and all I suppose. Once I put that fear to rest, it came down to other factors I guess.
Like anywhere though, it often takes contacts to help with a job, and that is no exception over here. Even if you don´t know anyone in the UK, it was mind-blowing to me that you could often call a company looking for work, and speak directly to the chief pilot or dfo! The secretary didn´t even think about hanging up on you.

It´s not too hard to get a network going here if you persevere.
The work is great, and I´m certainly enjoying it.
Hope this helps!

Blue_side_up

blue_side_up · Post by **blue_side_up** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 4:39 am

Guess I should also mention...
A EU passport is a MUST for working over here, unless you are coming over on a validation (more than 500hrs experience on the jet type you´ll be flying).

wallypilot · Post by **wallypilot** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 5:39 pm

Well, i don't have the passport, but I have basically the equivalent of landed immigrant status for the UK....they call it the Right of Abode. It also permits me to live and work in the EU, as far as I know.

B.S.U: What eqpt are you flying? What kind of routes?
Thanks for the helpful info.

blue_side_up · Post by **blue_side_up** » Sun Mar 21, 2004 6:05 am

equip: f/o 747 (classics)
routes: so far, everywhere xcept the Americas

Good luck! There are jobs out there, you just have to find them. Be persistent.

mysidesdone · Post by **mysidesdone** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 4:56 am

wow... just finished last of the 14 exams.... glad those are behind me!!

loopy · Post by **loopy** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 7:18 am

I'm still paying off my university student loans, and I spent about 40G's on the flight training. The thought of spending that kind of coin again is daunting.

My Canadian ATPL should be signed off within the month. I've got the 500 multi crew stuff licked hands down on a B200.

My wife was born in the UK (Wales). Does anybody know if that gives me the right to work in the UK and Europe?

Blue side, do you find the rewards worth it. Does the pay provide a good lifestyle?

loopy · Post by **loopy** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 7:20 am

bang head What gives with the wide windows?!!

jackalope · Post by **jackalope** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 8:23 am

BE20 doesn't count for the multi-crew requirement

loopy · Post by **loopy** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 3:14 pm

Bluesideup mentioned that he was able to qualify his King Air time with a letter from his CP. I supposse that route could be followed. My operation is always flown 2 crew and our ops manual stipulates 2 crew with PPC's.

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