AME career

[withers]

Im am signed up for the bcit ame m program
but after reading this forum is the industry worth getting in too?
what are the hours and pay like?
how are people treated?
is this a career im going to end up being disappointed in?
im having serious second thoughts now

[Dust Devil]

Usually these threads are filled with guys saying "don't do it" I can only give you my perspective as an operator that there is no profession in this industry more needed desperately than good AME's. I've been searching for a good one for a long time and have yet to find anyone. There is no other position in more demand right now. If you are an AME and you are good there is no reason to be unemployed.

[longjon]

This should be an interesting thread

Are you mechanically inclined, can you move away from the lower mainland (go north young man)

Yes you can make a career of it but what you read here is very true with regard to poor pay, lay offs, and no respect.

Be prepared to move more than once, you get to a shop where the team leader does the release in the log & why do they need more than 1 licenced guy so the rest get paid lower. You get your licence and move on.

Go into any larger AMO and you will find 80% apprentices, several with licence still wet and very few older experienced people. Ask yourself why this is?

[log sheet]

Usually these threads are filled with guys saying "don't do it" I can only give you my perspective as an operator that there is no profession in this industry more needed desperately than good AME's. I've been searching for a good one for a long time and have yet to find anyone. There is no other position in more demand right now. If you are an AME and you are good there is no reason to be unemployed.

You should post this on your lunchroom bulletin board, I bet all your AME's would love to know you think they all suck!
Cheers!

[shannon]

Dust Devil, when you think everyone else is wrong perhaps its time to look at yourself. Just a thought.

Withers, its a job like any other, its got its ups and downs, its assholes and a healthy number of good people to offset the bad. In the end, just like every job, its not what you do for a living, its how you live your life when your not at work that will dictate your happiness. Its easy when looking at this forum to only see the bad, but if it was really as bad as it seems then I would hope that the angry people would change jobs.

[Pat Richard]

You should have been having serious first thoughts, lol.

I'm guessing you just want hear "Everything will be ok." regardless of what you've read here, but why? I mean how many more posts do you need to read???

For DD's post, Im not surprised he can't find anybody decent. Aren't you out in Saskabush somewhere? There, Manitoba, anywhere north is always looking for good guys, but good guys aren't interested in being in those places. Most who do go there, go there as greenhorns and leave when they are more experienced. Money sometimes looks okay on paper, but usually when the money is mediocre you will see the "great hunting/fishing/camping/affordable houses" angle used.

If you are planning on staying in the lower mainland, like most bcit products, expect a hard time finding work as a green grad.

I really don't feel like going into this more, as it has been repeated MANY times here.

Maybe you need to drop the $10g for tuition, and spend the next 20 years paying for it, plus all your tools, a house, car(s), kid(s), credit cards, etc working nights/holidays/weekends/birthdays, etc, etc,etc,etc, at around 25 a/hr(licensed)before you understand that maybe people on here weren't BS'ing you.

In the end, just like every job, its not what you do for a living, its how you live your life when your not at work that will dictate your happiness

Sleeping during the day and having weekdays off(when everyone else is working) always made me very happy, as did renting forever. The theory of that quote is correct, but this business has a habit of intruding into most workers time off. I wont even get into having a company cell phone....

[flyinggreasemonkey]

Nope
Shit
Shit
Nope

[HS-748 2A]

Nope
Shit
Shit
Nope

I think your last "nope" was suposed to be a "yes".

[flyinggreasemonkey]

No that's how I meant it to be. The pay sucks and most managers\owners would sell YOUR soul for an extra dollar or hour under budget (hell even a jelly donut). In the end it really isn't worth taking the shit end of the stick in the industry. The best way to make a million dollars in aviation is to start with 10 million.
But on the other hand, seeing something you did like change an engine or make a repair turn out perfectly and seeing the plane safely rumble off into the distance...not many feelings like it.
If only the those higher up in the industry would recognize our true monetary and intellectual significance, then we might be paid on par with other skilled traded.

[Dust Devil]

Usually these threads are filled with guys saying "don't do it" I can only give you my perspective as an operator that there is no profession in this industry more needed desperately than good AME's. I've been searching for a good one for a long time and have yet to find anyone. There is no other position in more demand right now. If you are an AME and you are good there is no reason to be unemployed.

You should post this on your lunchroom bulletin board, I bet all your AME's would love to know you think they all suck!
Cheers!

I don't have any ame's that's why I use a contracted amo. Thus why the search continues. Slam Saskatchewan all you want. I didn't say anything offensive to anyone but if some people here want to find a pissing match look for someone else.

BTW the add I posted here some time ago was offering $70,000/year I don't think that qualifies as crap pay but to some maybe it does.

[HS-748 2A]

flyinggreasemonkey, I'm basically with ya.

Pay has finally gotten decent for me but it's been a battle for sure.

You're right about seeing a job through and how it feels. There is something about fixing shit that is a bit like crack to me. I also like steam cleaning a wheel well, jacking the thing up and ripping out the grimey old gear leg and putting in a shiney new clean one. I find a gratification in that that I cannot define.

I also like how the fact that I am good with my hands and own an enormous collection of tools, allows me a very certain type of freedom and independence.

I do all my own renos at home and restore motorcycles, trucks, boats etc, etc. Fly for fun too and save big $$ on my own maint exp.

I'm also running a couple side-line enterprises that put my skills to good use as well but I won't get into that here.

If you're looking for a 9-to-5 job or to be coddled in any way, this job sure as hell aint for you.

"How are people treated?", Withers asks.

Well, like anything in life, you can be a complainer and a victim or you can put your shoulder to the wheel and get on with it.

If you're the person they 'need' - you have a lot of clout and you can call the shots to quite an extent.

If you're intend on waiting for a silver platter, you shall forever live amoung the Proles.

That's in your court.

If you are good at what you do, don't bother getting in with a big union shop. It's a totall waste because you'll be shit-canned at the drop of a hat while the lazy dog-fcuker with a week's more seniority than you stays bellied right up to the trough - probably promoted out of harm's way.

Stick to the smaller shops where the cream has a chance to rise to the top. Big fish, small pond.

Dust Devil - 70k is pretty respectable. Where is your operation, what sort of fleet, how many a/c, what is it you want - ?

You need an AME who can run the entire AMO, Q.A., P.R.M. ect?

Are you looking to start an AMO or is your fleet private?

'48

[Dust Devil]

flyinggreasemonkey, I'm basically with ya.

Pay has finally gotten decent for me but it's been a battle for sure.

You're right about seeing a job through and how it feels. There is something about fixing shit that is a bit like crack to me. I also like steam cleaning a wheel well, jacking the thing up and ripping out the grimey old gear leg and putting in a shiney new clean one. I find a gratification in that that I cannot define.

I also like how the fact that I am good with my hands and own an enormous collection of tools, allows me a very certain type of freedom and independence.

I do all my own renos at home and restore motorcycles, trucks, boats etc, etc. Fly for fun too and save big $$ on my own maint exp.

I'm also running a couple side-line enterprises that put my skills to good use as well but I won't get into that here.

If you're looking for a 9-to-5 job or to be coddled in any way, this job sure as hell aint for you.

"How are people treated?", Withers asks.

Well, like anything in life, you can be a complainer and a victim or you can put your shoulder to the wheel and get on with it.

If you're the person they 'need' - you have a lot of clout and you can call the shots to quite an extent.

If you're intend on waiting for a silver platter, you shall forever live amoung the Proles.

That's in your court.

If you are good at what you do, don't bother getting in with a big union shop. It's a totall waste because you'll be shit-canned at the drop of a hat while the lazy dog-fcucker with a week's more seniority than you stays belied up to the trough - probably promoted out of harm's way.

Stick to the smaller shops where the cream has a chance to rise to the top. Big fish, small pond.

Dust Devil - 70k is pretty respectable. Where is your operation, what sort of fleet, how many a/c, what is it you want - ?

You need an AME who can run the entire AMO, Q.A., P.R.M. ect?

Are you looking to start an AMO or is your fleet private?

'48

Hey '48

I'd actually rather not discuss my business plan here. Too many trolls that would just sling crap around. The plan has been put on hold for a bit anyway as I've entered a new contract with an AMO.

[SeptRepair]

HS-748 has the positive attitude and for the most part is bang on. Not sure if HS-748 has kids, but man if you do and still manage to do everything you have said, then your a god.

[Pat Richard]

Saskabush - it is what it is, and I was'nt slamming it, just pointing out most aren't interested in what it has to offer, hence no luck finding experienced people, even in a recession. Hunting and fishing ain't everything.

Took this from another thread where it was posted today

I had to register and make an account just for this thread.

I got into aviation about 1.5 years ago, thought to my self "this will be sweet, big money, state of the art machinery, respect ect." It couldnt be further from the truth. You have no options, you cannot turn down anyjob, there is 100 people waiting to fill it, you'll end up working for about 15 bucks an hour if your lucky.

Why is it like this? i have NO IDEA. There is TONNES of money floating around aviation industry but i havnt seen any. In retrospect I would have rather gone to school to become a plumber and glue PVC together and make $20+ right outta school, not have to move, nvr get laid off ect.

I would have been better off blowing my $XX,XXX amount of school money up my nose and keeping my old career for 25 bucks an hour doing equally shitty work.

I know apprentices just about 4 years, in TC exams done, ready to be license in under 3 months, and they are dying to get out of this industry.


IT sucks, I honestly wish I found this website befor I ever went to school I woulda ran so fast and kept my money.

The schools are a business (duh) and they are in business to make money (duh) they will tell you whatever to enroll, they are business men. there is no glamor to be had here, or decent money to be made. industry is not screaming for people (there favorite line) and there is no massive 'baby boomer retirement' coming up, its all a wash man, its all BS and its bad for you.

take what you read here as the truth. these people and my self are not in some secret cult dedicated to scaring people on the internet away from our precious jobs and we all get richer from it. At least learn from our mistakes and dont do it your self, or learn the hard way (some people have too)

Or be like me and have however many thousand dollars worth of debt, unemployed, looking for a job outside of aviation

Some one you might want to chat with Withers.

[HS-748 2A]

HS-748 has the positive attitude and for the most part is bang on. Not sure if HS-748 has kids, but man if you do and still manage to do everything you have said, then your a god.

No kids yet Sept, though I practice as often as I can.

Kids are in the long range plans though and I realize that may put a damper on some things.

I hope all my irons in the fire in the short to medium term are going to hold me in good stead when that day comes though.

I'm not 30 years old yet and maybe my opinion of things will change too. I somehow doubt it though. It's all about carving yourself a notch. A comfortable notch that gives enough reward and enough challenge to keep a person happy.

To the original poster, Withers - the fact that you're asking the questions you are makes me think you won't be happy in this industry.

I have decided something too. There are several posters on here who do nothing but tell us all how bad it is. Often times, they really all sound exactly the same.

I've decided, I have nothing to gain in contradicting them. The marketplace is driven by supply and demand. The demand is out there and the supply is dwindling. That bodes well for me. I could always use a few more sheckels tossed my way.

Dust Devil, I wish you the best of luck. Your operation sounds interesting and it's the kind of thing I'd probably have lunged at if I my roots wern't already so firmly enterenched where they are.

Withers - if you still are going to go for it, as has been said before, "Go North" - It's the best of the old big-fish-small-pond scenario; if you've got what it takes!

Regards,

'48

[Dust Devil]

Saskabush - it is what it is, and I was'nt slamming it, just pointing out most aren't interested in what it has to offer, hence no luck finding experienced people, even in a recession. Hunting and fishing ain't everything.

Hmmmm lowest unemployment rate in the country steady growing population and aside from the potash price we have hardly been effected by the recession compared to everywhere else in the country.

Ya you're right who wants to be here. Glad you are happy where you are.

[iflyforpie]

Saskabush - it is what it is, and I was'nt slamming it, just pointing out most aren't interested in what it has to offer, hence no luck finding experienced people, even in a recession. Hunting and fishing ain't everything.

Hmmmm lowest unemployment rate in the country steady growing population and aside from the potash price we have hardly been effected by the recession compared to everywhere else in the country.

Ya you're right who wants to be here. Glad you are happy where you are.

With life about to get 7% more expensive in this province, Saskabush is starting to look pretty good. $70K/yr there would probably equal over $100K/yr here factoring in the sunshine tax...

[tyndall]

I got into aviation about 1.5 years ago, thought to my self "this will be sweet, big money, state of the art machinery, respect ect." It couldnt be further from the truth. You have no options, you cannot turn down anyjob, there is 100 people waiting to fill it, you'll end up working for about 15 bucks an hour if your lucky.

In reality, this can be said about most jobs. There is always someone somewhere making the big bucks working on the latest and greatest while management kisses their feet. And everyone thinks they will be just like him.

Let's substitute IT for aviation. In it for 15 years, last 8 with a small company, laid off. Every 12 year old thinks he's a 'puter expert. Kids are leaving high school with Microsoft certifications. Everybody wants new computers but won't pay a fair price for them. Companies view computers as an expense like toilets, and IT departments as an expense like cleaning staff. Old crap computers that only get replaced if smoke pours out of them, support staff to support the people doing the "real work". Businesses can't afford to pay experienced techs and don't have to when they can get certified noobs to work for minimum wage. No money, old crap, no respect. It wasn't like this 10 years ago and it's getting worse. Sound familiar?

Shall we try auto mechanics, who are competing with every guy that has a backyard and a toolbox? Truck drivers, now that every major carrier has their own training school? Plumbing seems to be an exception, but I don't know anyone that got into it because they liked the work. When nobody wants to do a job the rate goes up. If you can claim you have job satisfaction when someone's sh!t is flowing over the tops of your boots, you deserve the money. My best friend owns a plumbing company, has two new Mercedes and a huge new house with a pool bigger than most hotels. His employees rent houses or trailers and live paycheck to paycheck. But they know one day they'll be just like him...

[Gyroscopic]

Hey all,

I am graduating from a maintenance program in a couple months and have been on the prowl searching for an apprenticeship anywhere i can for rotary or fixed. I have been applying all over canada and to many companies who do overseas work, although i havent had any bites yet im still confident that i will be able to find something somewhere where i can gain experience, which from what ive been hearing is the hardest and most crucial part.. if you are willing to "GO NORTH" this should be alot easier.

Withers, if you like working with your hands, like a challenge in any sort of way.. whether it be mechanically or mentally with the people or situation your in then i think this is something you should try, once you get your schooling done and you decide you dont like it there are many other industries who would jump at the chance to hire a fresh AMT graduate, as the program covers a very broad range of subjects.

like most industries the pay is shit to start, but again like most industries you have to put in the time and get the experience before the good pay comes along.

my 2 cents,

gyro

[tyndall]

I got into aviation about 1.5 years ago, thought to my self "this will be sweet, big money, state of the art machinery, respect ect." It couldnt be further from the truth.

One more thing. A year and a half ago the GA fleet still averaged over 30 years old and there were still 727s in use. If you thought that you'd be working on Cirrus, G-650s or A380s a couple of years into your new career, obviously you didn't do any research before you signed up.

[ramp_rat]

Being an apprentice is like an investment that grows, pay is shit as an apprentice, ones licensed pay grows, and endoresed= more money. From my experience as an apprentice, the first one and half year was great in a way that a lot of the people around me were great to teach and show me a lot of things and I was also working with whole bunch of apprentices. The only thing that I really didnt like was my production manager. He was an a**hole. Everytime he came to work monday morning, it felt like there was a trail of dark cloud behind him, had to pick a broom and pretend like I was busy!! Once I got my license and endorsement, a lot of guys "treat me more like a man rather than just a young kid". Don't expect that you'll be fixing airplanes in the hangar all the time, oh no, be prepared to also work under extreme cold or hot conditions. So, good luck!!

[Gyroscopic]

Ramp rat: just tryin to give him another perspective from someone who is doing what withers is considering.. and, correct me if im wrong.. but most of what i said is pretty bang on no?

[iflyforpie]

Talk about listening to a guy who hasn't got a job in aviation!!!

From someone who's been in this industry for ten years, his description sounds pretty accurate...

[ramp_rat]

Ramp rat: just tryin to give him another perspective from someone who is doing what withers is considering.. and, correct me if im wrong.. but most of what i said is pretty bang on no?

You are right, I was meant to change my posting! Not here to bash anyone except my old boss!!

[Pat Richard]

like most industries the pay is shit to start, but again like most industries you have to put in the time and get the experience before the good pay comes along.

and you have experienced this working in aviation??? Aren't you a student giving advice as to how the industry is?? That's what I thought..

I dunno if you missed the thread at the top of this forum, or the MANY previous threads over the years on this topic, but the money not coming IS the problem. This is from EXPERIENCED AME's, not greenhorns. Does .50 cents an hour sound like a great deal for signing out an airplane? How about a buck more?? Awsomeness. What the hell, I'll rent TWO basement suites when I start making that kind of money....

As for "Going North" being the end all be all, I'll just say this. Some of the biggest hack mechanics I've worked with have been from the north, with some notable exceptions.
"Honey out of dogshit" is the motto that is favorite amongst many I have met, and most have been extremely proud of themselves for practicing it regularly. "Git r done" is the more current vernacular. Everything from maybe using components "saved" in thier tool boxes, to possibly making there own rudder deflection gauge(with no manufacturers instructions 'cause it was TOO expensive) are just some of the many things I might have seen. The most sickening aspect to this was the ever present bravado and arrogance about maybe carrying out such stupidity, as many would might offer(bragging)up the experience to you, if you missed it. Real heroes.

If one does decide to take the plunge, try not to be intimidated by the myth of the "northern superman ame", that so many from there like to go on about. Most are really just full of themselves, and just want to let everyone know how great they think they is. Kinda cute, in a pathetic sort of way, but nothing worthy of emulation.
DO try to remember that you are maintaining airplanes. Not snowmobiles, not chainsaws, not dirt bikes, not your outboard motor, not plumbing in your mobile home, but AIRPLANES. Rules and procedures apply, and are mandatory, not optional.
If you can keep that perspective, and hack the cold/bugs for a couple years, it might be worth it, but do not forget to factor in what it will cost you to live there. How does $1500++ a/mo sound for a whatever basement suite in a not so great part of town? Don't believe me, check it out.

The scenery for most places in the north was pretty killer though, and it could almost justify going there in itself.
Better yet, take the $10G tuition money, and just take a trip. I could almost promise you that you would find that path more rewarding.



Patricia Richard

la fin