Polish Pesident Dies in Crash

[Oor Wullie]

Woke up to read this horrible news this morning. May the victims R.I.P. and may those families involved find peace.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/europe/04 ... tml?hpt=T1

[robbreid]

TU-154M Polish Air Force registered '102'
Reporting 87 fatalities - unconfirmed - crashed on fourth attempt to land in heavy fog.

BBC News

Daily Mail News

from ASN;

A Tupolev 154M passenger jet, operated the Polish Air Force, was destroyed when it crashed on approach to Smolensk Airport (LNX) in poor visibility. All on board were killed in the accident, including Polish President Lech Kaczynski.
The airplane departed Warszawa-Okecie Airport (WAW), Poland, carrying Polish President Lech Kaczynski, his wife, several Members of Parliament, President of the National Bank of Poland Slawomir Skrzypek, Chief of General Staff Franciszek Gagor, the Deputy Minister of Foreign Affairs Andrzej Kremer and a number of passengers and crew members. The Tu-154 struck trees and broke up.
Weather reports at 08:00 CET indicated a temperature at Smolensk of 1°C, Dew Point:1°C, wind from 140 degrees at 6 knots, Pressure: 1026 hPa, heavy fog.

[ywgflyboy]

What a terrible incident and to lose such a number of high standing government members, awful.

[flyinthebug]

Very sad news indeed. My condolences to the families involved.

This has really left Poland in a political nightmare. Their Prime Minister will now step in as the country leader. That is the equivilant of our Governor General taking over Canada. Why were so many high ranking officials all on the same plane? They purposely plan for this in North America..i.e the President and VP never fly together ever. Same in Canada, PM and Deputy PM never fly on same aircraft.

Either way, another sad day for Aviation.

RIP.

[robbreid]

http://www.thekathrynreport.com/ Best site for updates and video . . .

[Doc]

This was a total waste of life, brought to you by two egotistical pilots! Political fallout aside, this was a prime example of "get home itis". FOUR attempts to land in heavy fog. Give your heads a shake! Putting all your "eggs" in one basket, then turning that basket over to this kind of thinking is sickening! This is indeed a political disaster for Poland, and a prime example of what NOT to do in an airplane! I'm sure there was a suitable alternate within range of this large jet. WHY do pilots continue to perform in this way? Very basic airmanship here....and common sense?
I was very saddened to hear the news....but, COME ON PEOPLE!!

Before you slag me for my appearing to be "unsympathetic" in this matter.....imagine this happening to Air Force One.

[raven54]

I didn't want to break the ice on this one, so I'll thank Doc. Four attempts to land, really though, what the fark? I don't care if the back of the plane is full of convicted criminals or presidents and nobel prize winners, I fly the plane the same way. What a shame. Condolences to the families of the deceased.

[station60]

We still don't know all the facts. Until we do, let's not pass judgment on what the pilots did or didn't do. Thanks

[Snagmaster E]

We still don't know all the facts. Until we do, let's not pass judgment on what the pilots did or didn't do. Thanks

I second that. It's too easy to play Monday-morning quarterback here.

[Siddley Hawker]

Sad thing. They were on their way to Smolensk to observe the 70th anniversary of the Katyn Forest massacre.

[2R]

Some Russian airports have large jet engines on trucks used that use the jet blast to clear away fog from the threshold.If they had started to use that equipment maybe it would make sense to have another look,but Four approaches does look bad.
Plane load of important people ,i wonder how many "important" people were using transmitting devices on the approach.All it needs is a small tear in the radio sheilding to bend the ILS signal.
Does that airline warn about using transmitting devices during take-offs and landings.
The tapes if they find them will make an educational listen and they should pull the phone logs of the PAX as well as they pilots may have followed the bent signal.

[The Old Fogducker]

Four approaches? Come off it.

The pilots must have been paid by the mile.

OFD

[pika]

...as they pilots may have followed the bent signal.

For real?

[CpnCrunch]

Plane load of important people ,i wonder how many "important" people were using transmitting devices on the approach.All it needs is a small tear in the radio sheilding to bend the ILS signal.
Does that airline warn about using transmitting devices during take-offs and landings.
The tapes if they find them will make an educational listen and they should pull the phone logs of the PAX as well as they pilots may have followed the bent signal.

According to discussion on pprune, there is no ILS at that airport. So it looks like they were doing a visual approach in heavy fog!

[Snagmaster E]

A lot of approaches between ILS and Visual.

[CpnCrunch]

A lot of approaches between ILS and Visual.

Sorry, I meant "visual". They were at treetop level in heavy fog during what appears to be a non-precision approach.

[CpnCrunch]

Here's more info:

http://www.khaleejtimes.com/DisplayArti ... ernational

"As the Kremlin ordered a ‘detailed’ investigation into the deadly crash in Smolensk in western Russia, an air force official said the plane’s pilots had repeatedly ignored instructions from Russian air traffic controllers.

‘At a distance of 1.5 kilometres (0.9 miles) the air traffic control group discovered the crew had accelerated its downward descent and begun descending beneath its glide path,’ Lieutenant General Alexander Alyoshin, deputy head of Russia’s air force, said in televised remarks.

‘The head of the group ordered the crew to return to horizontal flight, and when the crew did not fulfil the instruction, ordered them several times to land at another airport,’ Alyoshin said.

‘Nonetheless the crew continued to descend. Unfortunately this ended tragically,’ he added. "

...

"Eyewitnesses and Smolensk airport officials who had been awaiting Kaczynski’s arrival since early morning told an AFP reporter that his plane had circled several times in the low visibility.

It made three approaches to land before skimming the treetops and crashing sideways on its fourth descent, they said."

[CrackerJack]

I think there is more to it than "get home itis". I wouldn't be surprised it the captain had some serious pressure from the cabin to land there. I believe one of the presidential pilots was threatened dismissal in 2008 when refusing to land in Tbilisi during war. It is a tragedy nonetheless.

[Brown Bear]

Well, he's been permanently "dismissed" now. Fools!

[robbreid]

Accident aircraft '101'

[Caracrane]

4th attempt...

[Caracrane]

flew in fog half of my career, and learned to get the.f.. out of there after a second try.

[Pirx]

This is a hurtful historical irony.
All the people on board were traveling to Katyn to commemorate the 70th anniversary of Katyn massacre. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyn_massacre
As far as I know, this was the first time Russian government officials had admitted to the historical fact and they were to attend as well. Many hoped it may be the beginning of a healing process between the two nations.

[2R]

...as they pilots may have followed the bent signal.

For real?

http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/CAP756.PDF
Loads to read ,enjoy.
The study is a new one and does not take into account old airplanes with poor shielding caused by wear and tear of access for maintenance and repairs etc.I think the old study i read mentioned the shielding but i will have to find it.Just take a look at any aircraft that has been a repair shop and all the scratches on the cables .....not saying that this was a factor in this particular crash but i prefer to have the cell phones and Hard drives off for landing when i am going to down to minimums.
Just saying....
Fly safe

[pika]

For your next trick why don't you reference an accident that is blamed on pax used mobile phones?