Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

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Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by JakeYYZ »

http://landmarkreport.com/andrew/2011/0 ... -container
Television and radio pundit David Menzies found himself in a dangerous situation with his 9-year old son yesterday after doing the unthinkable — taking photographs in Toronto’s downtown Yonge-Dundas Square. After enjoying a lunch of pizza and bubble tea, Menzies deigned to use his new camera to take pictures of the surroundings, much to the dismay of a nearby hijab-wearing Muslim women.
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by Expat »

Remember that song? "Shoot them up babe... Come on shoot them up..."
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by North Shore »

Risible.

Lots of pictures of buildings there with Muslims incidentally in the background :roll:

Poking a wasp's nest and then complaining about getting stung is pretty sad.
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by JakeYYZ »

Northy:
1) Is there -any- excuse whatsoever for assaulting a complete stranger because they pointed a camera in your general direction in a public place?
2) Is there -any- excuse whatsoever for police refusing to charge a person with assault when there is picture evidence, video evidence AND cooperative witnesses?
That's the issue here. It’s irrelevant if David Menzies is the biggest schmuck in the entire world. Or do we only protect “nice” people in your world?
Frankly Northy, there are some things in life we just don't have to put up with. Getting smacked in the head while out for a stroll on Dundas Street is right up there near the top of the list.
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by azimuthaviation »

He's lucky he got away with just a punch to the head. Most people dont take to having their civil rights violated and are well within their right to use whatever force they deem necessary to protect those rights. Remember when we used to have rights in this country, and people behaved with decency and respect?
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by System Message »

azimuthaviation, this one is about the photographer. Your comment was appropriate for the thread about the robber.
viewtopic.php?f=49&t=75716
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by azimuthaviation »

Good point. So if a known burglar was on the street taking pictures of your house would you go outside and try to stop him? I would construe that as a threat and given the "photographers" history in this case, he was being at the minimum provocative, and at the most threatening. And the police officer apparently saw it that way too
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by System Message »

What is the photographers history?
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Post by Beefitarian »

Expat wrote:Remember that song? "Shoot them up babe... Come on shoot them up..."
I bet I don't. This one? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pk30a0qsVIk
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by JakeYYZ »

AA..On the other hand, if Menzies had of broken into her home to take the picture of her and THEN been assaulted, the Police would have been able to lay charges against our muslim friends ... but I digress....What civil rights violation are you referring to? There is police video camera recording throughout Dundas Square, where this incident took place.
Google is your friend, System M. Do you think the cops Googled him? Me neither
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by 2R »

There was a story about some guy taking pictures of the CN tower not long ago,and the guy taking the pictures said it was a free country and they could take pictures anywhere in Toronto .
Seems like it is no longer a free country ,what changed ?

EDITED - Next time you get a break.
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by azimuthaviation »

The law also says a convicted pedophile can go to the park and take pictures of kids to share online. Thats your free country?
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by niss »

2R wrote: EDITED
How much more blatant racism can you fit in the post? This was just retarded.

Second, what ever happened to common courtesy? As much of a shutter bug as I am I feel uncomfortable taking photos of people in public and if I think it's a good photo I do so discretely. I am aware that I am invading their sense of privacy. If someone called me on it I would apologize and ask if they wanted it deleted. Not just be a dick and tell them to @#$! off.

I wouldn't want someone taking photos of me in the street. This reeks of starting shit for the sake of starting shit. If he was as antagonistic as he sounds then he deserves to have his camera slapped away. It reminds me of this:



As much as I like the menzoid, Menzies had this one coming.

And whether this is assault or not, I agree with the cop, as she said she wanted to grab the camera.
Assault

265. (1) A person commits an assault when

(a) without the consent of another person, he applies force intentionally to that other person, directly or indirectly;

(b) he attempts or threatens, by an act or a gesture, to apply force to another person, if he has, or causes that other person to believe on reasonable grounds that he has, present ability to effect his purpose; or

(c) while openly wearing or carrying a weapon or an imitation thereof, he accosts or impedes another person or begs.
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts ... .html#h-83

She did not intentionally apply force to Menzies, she did not threaten to apply force to him. She wanted to grab the camera. I would agree that there was an attempt at vandalism, or theft but not assault. If you were waving your hat in my face and I tried to grab it from you but I hid your hand instead and sprained your wrist. That is not assault. Granted this probably wouldn't have panned out if the sexes were reversed.

I don't go around flicking a bear in the nuts, because I don't want to be mauled.
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by Nark »

I don't give a flying-hootinany what religion she is, she does not have any right to privacy, IN A PUBLIC STREET.

I'm pretty comfortable with my ability to hit a target, so when I shoot a camera instead of the person taking the picture, I should only be charged with vandalism? That logic is asinine.

It's been a long while since I've looked up Canadian Criminal Code, however isn't it the victim of the assault who desides whether to pursue charges, not the police?

Would it be news if a Catholic woman did the same thing, of course not.
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by grimey »

No, it's entirely up to the crown. It's the victim's right to pursue a civil lawsuit for assault or battery, but the crown has full control over who gets criminally charged. Crimes are viewed as being against society as a whole, rather than an individual, and so the crown will pursue charges in order to achieve specific and general deterrence for the benefit of society. I imagine that if the victim didn't cooperate that the case might get dropped for lack of evidence though.
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by North Shore »

JakeYYZ wrote:Northy:
1) Is there -any- excuse whatsoever for assaulting a complete stranger because they pointed a camera in your general direction in a public place?
2) Is there -any- excuse whatsoever for police refusing to charge a person with assault when there is picture evidence, video evidence AND cooperative witnesses?
That's the issue here. It’s irrelevant if David Menzies is the biggest schmuck in the entire world. Or do we only protect “nice” people in your world?
Frankly Northy, there are some things in life we just don't have to put up with. Getting smacked in the head while out for a stroll on Dundas Street is right up there near the top of the list.
So far, Jake, all we have is Menzies' account of what happened. I'm going to assume (I know..) that the police/crown aren't the most liberal-minded people out there, and they have deigned to lay charges. Why? Is it perhaps because the 'evidence' in this case doesn't fit the facts as Menzies would have us believe? Could it possibly be because Menzies went out of his way to be deliberately provocative with his camera? Perhaps he took pictures of the Muslim women, was subsequently asked by them not to, continued, and then a scuffle developed?
So, in a vacuum, the answer to both of your questions above is: No, there's no excuse for that conduct. However I think that we're not in a vacuum here, and there's more to the whole thing than we're being told...given the animosity in North America, and elsewhere, between some 'conservatives' and Muslims, one wonders whether this situation was manufactured.

Nark:
I don't give a flying-hootinany what religion she is, she does not have any right to privacy, IN A PUBLIC STREET.
If I was walking down the street at home, and a tourist took a shot of a streetscape, which had me, my wife and the boys in it incidentally, then I have no expectation of privacy. However, if it was a deliberately targeted picture of us, then I think that I do have a right to be asked for my permission beforehand.
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by niss »

Nark wrote:I don't give a flying-hootinany what religion she is, she does not have any right to privacy, IN A PUBLIC STREET.

Can I quote you when I'm caught outside of a school or a daycare taking pictures of little children?
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by Shiny Side Up »

niss wrote:
Nark wrote:I don't give a flying-hootinany what religion she is, she does not have any right to privacy, IN A PUBLIC STREET.

Can I quote you when I'm caught outside of a school or a daycare taking pictures of little children?
Expectations of privacy are a lot like property values in that its all about location, location, location. The difference being in your example being that the kids in the daycare would be in a private location and should have an expectation of privacy, just as you should in your own home. If you were taking pictures of little kids running around out on a public street or in a public playground, you should have the right to do so - if on the other side you don't like the idea of having your picture taken out in public, then don't go out in public, that happens to be your particular problem.
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by niss »

Shiny Side Up wrote:
niss wrote:
Nark wrote:I don't give a flying-hootinany what religion she is, she does not have any right to privacy, IN A PUBLIC STREET.

Can I quote you when I'm caught outside of a school or a daycare taking pictures of little children?
Expectations of privacy are a lot like property values in that its all about location, location, location. The difference being in your example being that the kids in the daycare would be in a private location and should have an expectation of privacy, just as you should in your own home. If you were taking pictures of little kids running around out on a public street or in a public playground, you should have the right to do so - if on the other side you don't like the idea of having your picture taken out in public, then don't go out in public, that happens to be your particular problem.
Well I doubt very much that you would be cool with some creeper taking photos of your kids at the playground.
Same for any parent out there.
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by Cranium »

I would not be cool with it, but beyond asking politely to stop (or, if there are police standing by, asking them), all you can legally do is try to block the shot.
There is no reason to try to destroy a camera or attempt to harm a person.

I will admit that race is the only reason that this made the news. Truth be told, both sides probably should take some etiquette training.
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by 2R »

azimuthaviation wrote:The law also says a convicted pedophile can go to the park and take pictures of kids to share online. Thats your free country?
Not my area of expertise ,i must bow to your expertize on the subject of Pedophllia.

Edited
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by System Message »

I'll take d for 1000, Alex
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by niss »

2R wrote:
azimuthaviation wrote:The law also says a convicted pedophile can go to the park and take pictures of kids to share online. Thats your free country?
Not my area of expertise ,i must bow to your expertize on the subject of Pedophllia.



And around 70 people aged 12-18 were killed in Norway by whom?
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by 2R »

Interesting.A terrorist attacks and kills Americans and it is the fault of the Americans.
A madman attacks a group at a political camp and he is entirely to blame.The people attending the political camp are entirely blameless?
Who was it that said Politics is WAR without the bloodshed ?
Perhaps when your views become to far left or right you can become a target,but if you sit on the fence you make a nice target for both sides.
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Re: Conservative Commentator Attacks Muslim Mob with Canon!

Post by Shiny Side Up »

niss wrote: Well I doubt very much that you would be cool with some creeper taking photos of your kids at the playground.
Same for any parent out there.
No, I wouldn't be "cool" with it, but then If I was worried that such an area wasn't safe for my kids I wouldn't take them there. Its unfortunate that the world has become such a place that some guy takes a picture of some kids and its assumed that he must be some sort of "creeper". Aside from that, how does one know that one isn't having one's photo taken any time you're out in public? Its a risk you assume anytime you happen to be out and about and especially when one ventures in to more populated public places. The cops are out there taking pictures of people in public places all the time, so what "right" do you really feel you have not to be photographed? To quote the immortal Carlin : "Rights aren't rights if someone can take them away."

Now that being said, I do believe there are laws in place, that prohibit the use of identifying photos for publishing purposes without the consent of those who were photographed. All of the commercial photographers that I've worked with have a type of release form for this purpose. That's only to prevent someone from making money from your likeness without your consent, but there are no laws against photos for private use.
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