A request of the Moderators

[Canoehead]

Hey if you folks are going to EDIT posts for any reason, would you be so kind as to at least sign your work?

I know that you have been given the green light to do as you see fit, however there is no credibility or accountability with just editing but not saying who, and often even why you are doing so.

We seem to spend a lot of time slamming each others knowledge/experience/credibility, but really if you want to clean things up at all here (on this particular website), the "leadership" - that is, the moderators, need to lead the way.

Just a small request, that could have some favorable results for everyone.

EDITED once by Canoehead for spelling and grammatical errors.

[Colonel Sanders]

We seem to spend a lot of time slamming each others knowledge/experience/credibility

That's because you don't personally know the other guy. He could have 50,000 hours, he might have seen an airplane once on TV.

In the past, I have suggested that we have a user account flag, which appears on the left side column next to someone's post.

This flag would indicate that the poster had scanned in his/her ATPL (any category) and mailed it to the webmaster, with the file number clearly visible.

If someone has an ATPL, they probably have a clue. If not ...

[Beefitarian]

Meh, read my post sanders. If you can't tell I don't have a clue what good is my counterfiet certificate going to do anyone.

I don't care if it's signed, an explaination is nice. The mods that sign and explain the deletion make it seem much more legitimate. Even if I don't agree with the decision it's way easier to accept.

[ahramin]

Moved by ahramin.

[Beefitarian]

All three primary colours of light. That's a nice touch right there.

[sky's the limit]

Canoe,

Thanks for the suggestion.

If you'll notice, there are often explanations and a sig to go with - not that it matters or is required at all.

That said, there are very few of us, many of you, and your mind would boggle with the amount of editing, removing, and general fiddle #*@&$^! that goes on here for us. We are volunteers, and some of us have more time than others, so you can appreciate there is often very little time for additional referencing.

Again, you can reference the forum rules - if a post is edited or removed entirely it will have contravened them in some way, we do not summarily remove posts for our own amusement as you suggest.

Hope that helps.

stl

[Donald]

If someone has an ATPL, they probably have a clue. If not ...

Really?

All it means is that they survived a couple exams, and have a few more hours.


That's it.

[Colonel Sanders]

Really?

Someone with thousands of hours of flight time probably
knows more about aviation than someone with no pilot
licence (or even permit)

Really.

[azimuthaviation]

there are very few of us, many of you, and your mind would boggle with the amount of editing, removing, and general fiddle #*@&$^! that goes on here for us. We are volunteers, and some of us have more time than others, so you can appreciate there is often very little time for additional referencing.

You can always make me a moderator, lighten your workload

[Indanao]

Nobody on here but Pilots? Get a life Sanders...

[bandaid]

I either indicate that I have editted something or send a PM that I have editted.

[Canoehead]

I wasn't trying to open the door to another pissing match folks.

stl- I understand the volume is high. I also know that often it is signed, and often a reason given for the intervention. That is appreciated and can be respected. However, I never suggested that any of the mods simply edit/remove for their 'amusement', although I'm not convinced that there is unbiased or transparent moderating all the time. A thread questioning a certain operator's pilots actions in a traffic pattern comes to mind.

bandaid- I know you sign your work- again that is appreciated. I did consider that perhaps 'unsigned edits', anonymous really, might have had a PM advising the posts author of such.

Personally, I think there is way too much 'moderating' here. Yes it happens because it is an anonymous board, but it is often the same handful of culprits who contravene the rules. Why not a 3 strikes and out policy?

Anyway- I'm goin' back to read forum rules...

[bandaid]

We seem to spend a lot of time slamming each others knowledge/experience/credibility

That's because you don't personally know the other guy. He could have 50,000 hours, he might have seen an airplane once on TV.

In the past, I have suggested that we have a user account flag, which appears on the left side column next to someone's post.

This flag would indicate that the poster had scanned in his/her ATPL (any category) and mailed it to the webmaster, with the file number clearly visible.

If someone has an ATPL, they probably have a clue. If not ...

Well I am not an aviator, a fact that I do not hide. I can however tell the difference between a thoughtful, helpful, sincere comment from one that is made with the sole intention of stirring the pot through insults or belittlement. I do know what racsism, porn, vulgarity and a host of other non acceptable types of content are and I do know how to read the forum rules.
You want less moderation on here than it is simple. Follow the rules.

[Colonel Sanders]

I wasn't really speaking to people's attitudes
and feelings when I was proposing a visible
ATPL flag on someone's account. It has everything
to do with credibility, and the value of someone's
opinion and the weight that you might ascribe to
someone's perspective.

It might surprise you, but there's an awful lot
of nonsense on the internet (and I know you're
thinking, "Yes, much of it comes from you ...")

But here's a scenario. A pilot with no ATPL flag posts
that something is a great idea (eg VFR-only flight
over a solid cloud layer). Another pilot with no
ATPL flag agrees it's a great idea. Then 3 different
pilots with ATPL flags post that it's really not a great
idea.

Without the flags, it's unclear how what the merit
of the "great idea" is. With the flags, you gain a lot
more insight. Especially for the low-timers here.

Again, this has nothing to do with people's attitudes
or feelings, merely credibility, which is sorely lacking
on the internet.

And I'm not hung up on ATPL - I was just proposing
a simple binary flag for "experienced aviator". It might
be 10 years or 5,000 hrs of flight time or whatever,
but the possession of an ATPL is so simple to measure.

Anyways, credibility isn't as important as feelings are,
so I don't really expect this idea to go anywhere.

[sky's the limit]

Canoe,

With all due respect, I'm not sure you understand how these things work. For example, on other forums I'm part of in the motorcycle world there is zero tolerance for breaking the rules, once and you're banned for good - it is incumbent on you to know the rules and not break them. There is also a respectful attitude that exists within the group of posters - numbering in the tens of thousands. We have neither of those things here.

Your comment about too much moderation is, respectfully, based on no knowledge of what actually goes on here, the owners wishes for how the board is administered, or some of the absolutely mind-blowing posts we see. You have a user's perspective, and to suggest bias is understandable, but also incredibly off the mark. Again, there are protocols in place that you don't see or know about which govern how we try to run this circus. That people around here routinely feel justified in calling out the Mods or site owner is proof positive that over moderation is most definitely not a problem here. This thread on those other sites would not exist, and you'd be gone by now....

There is a three strikes and out policy btw, but it's not always that simple when looking at removing someone from the board completely.

Colonel Sanders has some valid points about user status/ranking, and we have been examining several types of this for a long time now, but there are inherent issues with most of these systems and Joe has not felt comfortable enough to install one. I for one would like to see something in place, but am with Joe that there needs to be something very good before we do it.

Anyway, that's about all I have to say on the subject. As Bandaid said, you want less moderation as a group, then follow the rules. It's really that simple.

stl

[PAJ]

Colonel Sanders has some valid points about user status/ranking, and we have been examining several types of this for a long time now,

I don't post much but I do frequent the site often. There is tons of great info as long as you can sift through all the garbage. You get to know who the knowledgeable/valuable posters are just like you get to know the others. I often search though a posters old posts to get a sense of their experience and attitude - it doesn't take long to form an opinion. A strictly enforced status/ranking system would certainly help in sorting the wheat from the chaff. Great idea!

PAJ

[Indanao]

Phony idea, from one of the worst violators of forum rules, e.g.: Sanders. He is banned, and comes back with a new handle. What if you need current ATR to post - would a PPL even qualify? And, what about Engineers, FAs, Dispatchers, Company Owners for that matter? Everyone wants to ride the wave - any wave - just so it suites their own agenda. Careful there, what goes around will be coming around. Too much BS for me. But, eh, I am just a passer through.

[bandaid]

What this site could be is what I witnessed as a father of a young pilot starting his career. He had a lot of wonderful advice from experienced pilots that were knowledgable and willing. A small number of people have scared away from this site the kind of people that these young pilots need to advise them on building thier careers. I would love to see these guys back and I would also like to see the juvenile characters who have this kind of knowledge put there efforts towards aviation and helping the industry in Canada rather than trying to discredit this site and Joe.

[Canoehead]

Canoe,

With all due respect, I'm not sure you understand how these things work. For example, on other forums I'm part of in the motorcycle world there is zero tolerance for breaking the rules, once and you're banned for good - it is incumbent on you to know the rules and not break them. There is also a respectful attitude that exists within the group of posters - numbering in the tens of thousands. We have neither of those things here.

Your comment about too much moderation is, respectfully, based on no knowledge of what actually goes on here, the owners wishes for how the board is administered, or some of the absolutely mind-blowing posts we see. You have a user's perspective, and to suggest bias is understandable, but also incredibly off the mark. Again, there are protocols in place that you don't see or know about which govern how we try to run this circus. That people around here routinely feel justified in calling out the Mods or site owner is proof positive that over moderation is most definitely not a problem here. This thread on those other sites would not exist, and you'd be gone by now....

There is a three strikes and out policy btw, but it's not always that simple when looking at removing someone from the board completely.

Colonel Sanders has some valid points about user status/ranking, and we have been examining several types of this for a long time now, but there are inherent issues with most of these systems and Joe has not felt comfortable enough to install one. I for one would like to see something in place, but am with Joe that there needs to be something very good before we do it.

Anyway, that's about all I have to say on the subject. As Bandaid said, you want less moderation as a group, then follow the rules. It's really that simple.

stl

sky- I think you have misunderstood the intent of my posts.

[sky's the limit]

With all due respect Canoe, please re-read what you posted - I have many times and I don't think I misinterpreted what you wrote. If you didn't intend it to come across that way I understand, this medium is wanting at best when it comes to clarity of communication, which is why it is particularly important to consider what you are posting and the point you're trying to make.

I'm not sure how this is to be taken any other way:

Hey if you folks are going to EDIT posts for any reason, would you be so kind as to at least sign your work?

I know that you have been given the green light to do as you see fit, however there is no credibility or accountability with just editing but not saying who, and often even why you are doing so.

stl