Buffalo in YZF

[sstocker31]

Just heard they landed in ZF with one gear up......thats all I know

[down north]

This time it was an Electra landed with one gear up (main gear).

The sched flights are all delayed as the main runway 16/34 is closed due to disabled aircraft as per NOTAM.

Looks like all gear collapsed at landing:

[flyinthebug]

http://aptn.ca/pages/news/2012/03/06/ho ... s-airline/

[Meatservo]

Looks like all gear collapsed at landing:

No it doesn't. There seems to be some stick-like object holding the nose up. I'm guessing it's the nose gear.

[down north]

It does look like that "stick like object" is pushed beyond its normal 90 degree gear down position. Maybe we can assume the gear is partially collapsed.

The aircraft is situated well left of the runway, I am wondering if the intentionally landed in the snow? It is interesting because the snow is currently quite deep in Yellowknife.
You might notice the Rudder is positioned hard right. I wonder if they were having a tough time in regards to directional control.

I am glad everyone walked away unhurt.

[Axial Flow]

I believe the left main and nose gear were down and the right main would not extend. Glad everyone was ok.

[BTyyj]

I believe the left main and nose gear were down and the right main would not extend. Glad everyone was ok.

In the article it said the aircraft went off the side. The majority of the nose gear is under the snow. It looks fully extended to me.

[rapid602]

You are always sorry to see this happen ... but I just read an article on this in a link above and everyone sounds safe and ok. Always good to see a safe ending to a bad situation.

Good flying to those involved.

[arctic_slim]

I can shed some information on this event.

The plane landed with right main gear stuck in the retracted position. I flew over them today as they were trying their last touch and go to try dislodge it but the pilot reported that the G's of the touch and go's were not as much as they had experienced during the steep turns they tried earlier so it won't dislodge it. It was up for a training flight from what he was saying, I guess they got more training than expected. They landed just as I was departing the zone, it was pretty damn chaotic in the airspace trying to get everyone either on the ground or out of the way, the controller did and awesome job handing it all.
The gear did not collapse, the aircraft just veered right as the wing came down and it went off the runway into a snowbank at pretty low speed.
They did say they had 6 people on board so im wondering if they had a camera crew on board filming for their tv show, it might all be on tape.

Anyway, after they lifted it with a crane and towed it back to the ramp, I could see the 2 right hand engines were damaged (obviously) and the outboard flaps were bent, but I could not see any other visible damage than that, although i'm sure there is more damage. I think she will fly again though.

The whole event was handled very professionally though, the controllers were awesome, the pilots of the Electra were professional and calm the entire time and did a grea job. Kuddos to them.

[Adiabatic]

Right main did not retract fully(unsafe gear indication), and got stuck in the wheel well. Right main would not extend, nor budge from where it got stuck upon first retraction.
Emergency procedures were done and exhausted. Multiple gear cycles were completed with no change, still stuck. Multiple positive G manoeuvres to stall buffet at 190kts were completed, as well as two touch and gos on the runway before we committed and bit the bullet...
We had a gut feeling that the eventual actual end result would happen, as we had about over an hour to think about it.
We were not training, we were returning from a Northern ice strip.
I also got a look at the gear when it was towed to the front of the hangar. No damage to the wing planks, no damage to the #1 and #2 props, nose gear and left main gear was down and locked on landing. No serious damage to fuselage, some small bits of debris to hull, no punctures.
Fact from the right seater...I hope to fly her again. That plane means a lot to me.
AB

[EA757]

Adiabatic,

I am pleased to see you and the rest of the crew are safe.
Excellent flying.

[flyinthebug]

Right main did not retract fully(unsafe gear indication), and got stuck in the wheel well. Right main would not extend, nor budge from where it got stuck upon first retraction.
Emergency procedures were done and exhausted. Multiple gear cycles were completed with no change, still stuck. Multiple positive G manoeuvres to stall buffet at 190kts were completed, as well as two touch and gos on the runway before we committed and bit the bullet...
We had a gut feeling that the eventual actual end result would happen, as we had about over an hour to think about it.
We were not training, we were returning from a Northern ice strip.
I also got a look at the gear when it was towed to the front of the hangar. No damage to the wing planks, no damage to the #1 and #2 props, nose gear and left main gear was down and locked on landing. No serious damage to fuselage, some small bits of debris to hull, no punctures.
Fact from the right seater...I hope to fly her again. That plane means a lot to me.
AB

You guys ALL did a great job yesterday. It became quite the non event due to the professionalism of the crew. Well done sir! I hope she flys again one day!

[arctic_slim]

That is awesome. I thought I heard heard something about a training flight when you guys were talking to the controller. Either way, the landing looked as successful as it can get, you guys were so calm and professional about it.

Was there a film crew on board for Ice Pilots? Or did they film it from the ground?

[Oxi]

Plenty of pictures http://imgur.com/a/uFkOP

Oxi

[BTyyj]

Was there a film crew on board for Ice Pilots? Or did they film it from the ground?

Joe said there was no "Ice Pilots" crew onboard, so no filming. Might have gotten it from the ground though.

[Big Pistons Forever]

Right main did not retract fully(unsafe gear indication), and got stuck in the wheel well. Right main would not extend, nor budge from where it got stuck upon first retraction.
Emergency procedures were done and exhausted. Multiple gear cycles were completed with no change, still stuck. Multiple positive G manoeuvres to stall buffet at 190kts were completed, as well as two touch and gos on the runway before we committed and bit the bullet...
We had a gut feeling that the eventual actual end result would happen, as we had about over an hour to think about it.
We were not training, we were returning from a Northern ice strip.
I also got a look at the gear when it was towed to the front of the hangar. No damage to the wing planks, no damage to the #1 and #2 props, nose gear and left main gear was down and locked on landing. No serious damage to fuselage, some small bits of debris to hull, no punctures.
Fact from the right seater...I hope to fly her again. That plane means a lot to me.
AB

The L 188 AFM emergency procedures section specifies a gear up landing in the event of a failure of one (or both) main gears to extend. I am curious as to why the Captain decided to do a gear down landing ?

[rapid602]

The L 188 AFM emergency procedures section specifies a gear up landing in the event of a failure of one (or both) main gears to extend. I am curious as to why the Captain decided to do a gear down landing ?[/quote]


This is a very interesting statement ... however .... I took an Aero Course and the Instructor was an Air Canada Capt. and I will leave him nameless for this point or observation. He was telling us of some situations that come up in the real world to weather, fuel, gear up landings etc. What he said changed the way I see all accidents and situations. He said there is not always stuff that is obvious and we should not judge as to why someone makes the choices that they make. He said look to see what happened and why it happened, but do not point fingers and accuse ... Thank You for That Mr. AeroCourse Instructor you were great.

So whenever situations like this gear up landing occur, its is great to see comments like the one quoted. I was not there so I am not going to even guess as to what happened and why. But it is certainly great to see all the commnets that are going to come from that statement. But as you read them .... look for the lesson, look at yourself and say what would I do, would I do it the same or would I do it different. But do not lay blame... that is not our jobs in here.

But I am sure when that crew walked to that aircraft that day ... the last thing they thought of was having to deal with that emergency and what the final outcome was.

They had a situation, dealt with it and are here to share the story .... good for them...

[Cat Driver]

Asking a question is not laying blame.

The question was valid.

[Redneck_pilot86]

I would think that the loss of directional control with some gear down vs the 4 damaged engines with all gear up would be a tough call. Knowing that they could save two engines with the gear down might have been part of the call? I don't see shutting 4 of them down on short final as a very plausible action, although I suppose it could be done.

[rapid602]

Asking a question is not laying blame.

The question was valid.

Cat Driver ... In my statement I didn't say he was laying blame. It may infact be a valid question. I only made the statement to share with others who read this forum, something that was told to me by someone who investigates situations that arise at Air Canada.

This very wise invididual shared something with a group of pilots. It changes the way I read about situations such as this gear problem. I now read them to learn. Nothing more and nothing less. I did say his comment was very interesting, and it was going to get some interesting comments. This is a free forum and he and anyone else can comment as they please. As are you.

[Redneck_pilot86]

The L 188 AFM emergency procedures section specifies a gear up landing in the event of a failure of one (or both) main gears to extend. I am curious as to why the Captain decided to do a gear down landing ?

Also, it sounds like the Right gear wasn't retracted either, maybe that changes it?

[magic wand]

DO we know they were able to retract the gear? Maybe it was what is was. STUCK - some up some down.
I do agree - IF - They were able to fully retract the gear they would/should land with it fully retracted.
I suspect the gear was stuck - part up / part down.

[angry inch]

Well done Adiabatic & Company. Hope you get to fly her again...

[flyinthebug]

Was there a film crew on board for Ice Pilots? Or did they film it from the ground?

Joe said there was no "Ice Pilots" crew onboard, so no filming. Might have gotten it from the ground though.

Just confirmed this morning...Joe was telling a "fib" as they (camera crew for Ice Pilots) were onboard and should make for an interesting episode next season!

[Adiabatic]

We elected to leave the left main and nose wheel down, to minimize damage to the rest of the airplane (airmanship). We saved two props and engines, and we saved the fuselage. Looks like at initial personal inspection that the right side wing planks were not damaged. #3 engine may still be salvageable, I didn't take a look under the cowlings yet. We did not pull the emergency shut-down handles prior to landing. We shut off the fuel and ignition switches on #3 and #4 at 100ft on committal to land, when we touched down, and after the right wing settled, we pulled all four handles. When we stopped pushed the fire bottles. To just shut the #3 and #4 engines down, and not pull the e-handles prior to landing, was also a choice to minimize damage to the right wing. The props would bend and curl up rather than a straight edge absorbing the forces with the change of the props and gear boxes coming off and puncturing the wing planks(which also hold the fuel). The #4 prop and gear box did come of in this situation, but luckily did not puncture the right wing planks. Some damage to the leading edge which is replaceable.
We thought that leaving the gear up would destroy all four props ($100,000) each and damage the fuselage from the shrapnel from #2 and possibly #1 prop, as they turn clockwise, and possibly damage the fuselage grinding down the runway and into the hard packed snow. The aircraft may have settled on the gear pods, but who knows. And for sure the front end of the ship would have been bouncing us around inside quite a bit as we smashed to the ground and plowed into the hard packed snow.
Deceleration forces felt to me, less than if you decided to stop after noticing a yellow light at the last moment in your car.
So hope that info helps a bit.

Food for thought on emergency procedures: Would you do an emergency decent from FL250, at 5000ft/min, high speed, with a sudden cabin depressurization? What caused the depressurization? Where are you? Remote or congested airspace? What damage was there to the plane? If your airspeed is faster what effect will that have?



I confirmed two days ago that no film crew was onboard.