Help with Approach Ban understanding

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Helipil0t
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Help with Approach Ban understanding

Post by Helipil0t »

I'm in the middle of preparing for my INRAT and am hitting a bit of a wall in understanding Approach Bans as they apply to helicopters. I'm going to break down what I think is correct and then would like to discuss a question that I fell across that contradicts my understanding. Hopefully someone can jump in and give me some enlightenment on the topic.

OK So.. This is how I understand it so far.

1- RVR minimum for Choppers is 1200
2- RVR A station is the only one that applies. (We can ignore RVR B reports)
3- RVR reports take precedence over Runway VIS or Ground VIS
4- Runway Vis takes Precedence over Ground VIS
5- RVR reports are the only VIS report that can impose a BAN on a Helicopter. (eg: If there are no RVR reporting stations available, we can attempt an approach regardless of visibility)
6- If RVR A is unserviceable and RVR B indicated less than 1200 you're still good to go.
7- RVR is below 1200 with localized phenomenon you're good to go
8- And finally RVR can fluctuate below and above 1200 and you're good to go

That in mind I was doing great answering sample exam questions till I fell across this one.

"You have an RVR A of 800 with Visibility of 1/4 mile. Can you attempt an approach?"

In my mind the answer would be NO but for some reason the answer is:
"Yes, the visibility permits you to conduct an approach regardless of the RVR value." :?

I thought it was solid in my head till this point. Now I feel as though it's all falling apart.
CARs specifically states that RVR takes precedence over reported ground vis. However the answer to this question implies that as long as either the RVR OR the VIS is greater than 1200 or 1/4 mile respectively.. you're ok to go. Seems contradictory to me.

Can anyone shed some light on this and perhaps help me maintain my sanity? :rolleyes:
I would be extremely grateful. :prayer:
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Pratt X 3
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Re: Help with Approach Ban understanding

Post by Pratt X 3 »

You missed number 9...
Approach Ban - General

602.129 (4) Where the RVR is reported to be less than the minimum RVR set out in subsection (3), as applicable, no person shall continue an instrument approach in an IFR aircraft unless

(d) the RVR is less than the minimum RVR, and the ground visibility at the aerodrome where the runway is located is reported to be at least one quarter of a mile
http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/r ... tm#602_129
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Helipil0t
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Re: Help with Approach Ban understanding

Post by Helipil0t »

Ah Cheers for that! I knew I missed something. So why do they specify that RVR takes precedence over VIS when it doesn't. As long as one is bellow minimums you're OK to attempt the approach? The other thing that bugs me is the fact that it mentions that none of these regs apply to part VII. Would we not all operate under section 7?
http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/r ... htm#703_41

This section just gets me confused.
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Helipil0t
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Re: Help with Approach Ban understanding

Post by Helipil0t »

Ok after some more reading I'm thinking 602.129 Section 1 refers to the fact that it doesn't include the restrictions imposed upon commercial operations. Section 4 lays out the exceptions when RVR is below minimums and applies to all. 703.41 details further restrictions for commercial ops over and above 602.129.

I think I got it straight in my head. Thanks again for the help. :)
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Shark-41
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Re: Help with Approach Ban understanding

Post by Shark-41 »

Approach ban is not applicable to helicopters in the arctic too...\

Cheers
S41
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asbs006
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Re: Help with Approach Ban understanding

Post by asbs006 »

Helipil0t wrote:Ah Cheers for that! I knew I missed something. So why do they specify that RVR takes precedence over VIS when it doesn't. As long as one is bellow minimums you're OK to attempt the approach? The other thing that bugs me is the fact that it mentions that none of these regs apply to part VII. Would we not all operate under section 7?
http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/r ... htm#703_41

This section just gets me confused.

The INRAT exam does not cover commercial operations. It's general aviation only.
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B52
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Re: Help with Approach Ban understanding

Post by B52 »

There are several new questions that don't appear in any of the books
and twists on old questions.

The mistake I made was going back and changing answers.

In particular there was a question on VOR's compared to each other
on the ground when the AIM or IPM provides no such example.

That's what you get for not getting a good night's sleep
the night before an exam.
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Condorito
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Re: Help with Approach Ban understanding

Post by Condorito »

B52 wrote: In particular there was a question on VOR's compared to each other
on the ground when the AIM or IPM provides no such example.

TC AIM COM SECTION

3.5.1 VOR Receiver Checks

In areas where RNAV routes have not been published,
VOR remains the primary NAVAID for use in Canada. It
is important that the accuracy of the aircraft equipment be
checked in accordance with principles of good airmanship
and aviation safety.

While standard avionics maintenance practices are used for
checking aircraft VOR receivers, dual VOR equipment may
be checked by tuning both sets to the same VOR facility and
noting the indicated bearings to that station. A difference
greater than 4˚ between the aircraft’s two VOR receivers
indicates that one of the aircraft’s receivers may be beyond
acceptable tolerance
. In such circumstances, the cause of
the error should be investigated and, if necessary, corrected
before the equipment is used for an IFR flight.
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