ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

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alkaseltzer
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by alkaseltzer »

Time for the NTSB & TSB to start sharpening pencils, check their camera gear and do a group huddle.
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Curiousflyer
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by Curiousflyer »

Hopefully CargoJet pilots see through this management facade.

There is no way they will move operations to the US, have you seen what cargo pilots make in the US?

There is no way that less restrictive fatigue rules results in more flight crew positions. Over the past year AC has been complaining bitterly about all the extra pilots they’d need with the new fatigue rules.
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newlygrounded
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by newlygrounded »

Curiousflyer wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 12:11 pm Hopefully CargoJet pilots see through this management facade.

There is no way they will move operations to the US, have you seen what cargo pilots make in the US?

There is no way that less restrictive fatigue rules results in more flight crew positions. Over the past year AC has been complaining bitterly about all the extra pilots they’d need with the new fatigue rules.
If the AC folks are anything to go by, never seen a more gullible group of people than pilots
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DHC-1 Jockey
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by DHC-1 Jockey »

alkaseltzer wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 8:17 am Word on the street is that George Sugar offered Sunwing pilots jobs during the fatigue vote.
It's true. We received an email from our MEC outlining preferential hiring of Sunwing pilots. Not a lot of people know, but SWG and CJ are both UNIFOR and are both the same local (UNIFOR 7378). When CJ joined UNIFOR, they did so under Sunwing's umbrella. Each pilot group however maintains their own finances, seniority list, etc.
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flyingcanuck
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by flyingcanuck »

DHC-1 Jockey wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 8:32 pm
alkaseltzer wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 8:17 am Word on the street is that George Sugar offered Sunwing pilots jobs during the fatigue vote.
It's true. We received an email from our MEC outlining preferential hiring of Sunwing pilots. Not a lot of people know, but SWG and CJ are both UNIFOR and are both the same local (UNIFOR 7378). When CJ joined UNIFOR, they did so under Sunwing's umbrella. Each pilot group however maintains their own finances, seniority list, etc.
We got the same argument for SR and Jazz and look out that turned out
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notwhoyouthinkIam
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by notwhoyouthinkIam »

WJ and WR have a similar arrangement.
:orcass: :orcass:
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Tbayer2021
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by Tbayer2021 »

I understand the pilots voted down the LOU. I'd like to take a moment to congratulate CJ pilots for standing up to dirty intimidation tactics from both the company and their own union. May be time to start rethinking UNIFOR representation.
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rudder
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by rudder »

Tbayer2021 wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 8:27 am I understand the pilots voted down the LOU. I'd like to take a moment to congratulate CJ pilots for standing up to dirty intimidation tactics from both the company and their own union. May be time to start rethinking UNIFOR representation.
Why would any professional pilot group in Canada choose UNIFOR for representation?

Morningstar pilots already made the right choice. Time for CJ pilots to do the same. Open period in spring 2023.
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Tbayer2021
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by Tbayer2021 »

rudder wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 8:33 am
Tbayer2021 wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 8:27 am I understand the pilots voted down the LOU. I'd like to take a moment to congratulate CJ pilots for standing up to dirty intimidation tactics from both the company and their own union. May be time to start rethinking UNIFOR representation.
Why would any professional pilot group in Canada choose UNIFOR for representation?

Morningstar pilots already made the right choice. Time for CJ pilots to do the same. Open period in spring 2023.

Wholeheartedly agree! ALPA is not without its fair share of problems, but to argue that you're better off under UNIFOR is just outright delusional.
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digits_
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by digits_ »

Tbayer2021 wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 8:27 am I understand the pilots voted down the LOU. I'd like to take a moment to congratulate CJ pilots for standing up to dirty intimidation tactics from both the company and their own union.
GREAT to hear!
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fish4life
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by fish4life »

Thank you cargo jet pilots for helping fight for the fatigue regulations that were so hard fought for and long overdue.
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Curiousflyer
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by Curiousflyer »

Tbayer2021 wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 8:27 am I understand the pilots voted down the LOU. I'd like to take a moment to congratulate CJ pilots for standing up to dirty intimidation tactics from both the company and their own union. May be time to start rethinking UNIFOR representation.

Congratulations to the CargoJet pilots for standing up for aviation safety in Canada.
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notwhoyouthinkIam
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by notwhoyouthinkIam »

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DHC-1 Jockey
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by DHC-1 Jockey »

notwhoyouthinkIam wrote: Fri May 14, 2021 5:26 pm So much good that did.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/busines ... 0sgCjdMOsE
It's behind a paywall I can't read.
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montado
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by montado »

DHC-1 Jockey wrote: Fri May 14, 2021 5:57 pm It's behind a paywall I can't read.
Canada’s Cargojet Inc. has threatened to move work to the United States unless it wins exemption from rules aimed at preventing pilot fatigue because of their cost, according to a deal rejected by its pilots seen by Reuters.

Cargojet has said it wants to reduce costs and grow in the United States as Canada’s largest cargo carrier benefits from an increase in air freight demand due to a decline in “belly capacity” from passenger aircraft grounded during the pandemic.

The Ontario-based company, which reported 30% higher quarterly revenues this month, has hired more than 60 pilots in the past three to four months to meet stronger demand and comply with Canadian rules that went into effect in December. Those shorten the number of hours pilots can work at night and extend their rest periods, among other conditions.

But 65% of Cargojet’s 283 pilots on Wednesday voted against supporting the company’s bid for an exemption from regulator Transport Canada, their union Unifor said by email. The company does not need union support for the exemption but hoped to have it.

Cargojet, which operates certain flights for Amazon.com Inc., had offered to protect jobs as part of the deal. Cargojet Chief Executive Ajay Virmani told analysts this month he was seeking a U.S. investment or partner for its “growth strategy across the border.”

Cargojet did not respond to a request for comment. Transport Canada was not immediately available for comment on Wednesday but said on Tuesday it had not received an exemption request from Cargojet.

Cargojet warned that it might have to lay off up to 130 pilots and move “part of its operation” to the United States due to fatigue rules that create “an uneven playing field” with American cargo carriers, according to the proposed deal.

The agreement generated controversy among pilots on both sides of the border, pitting concerns over protecting Canada’s hard-won fatigue rules against jobs at a time when cargo has emerged as an oasis of growth in aviation.

Scott Doherty, a Unifor official, said in an interview it was a problem for “us to be losing jobs to the U.S. during a pandemic because they play by a different set of rules.”

While U.S. cargo pilots have restrictions in their contracts to prevent fatigue, they are not comparably covered by federal regulations.

That disparity is a sore point for U.S. unions, including the Air Line Pilots Association (ALPA), which want the same American rules that protect against fatigue in the cockpit of passenger airlines to also cover cargo operators.
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fish4life
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by fish4life »

Transport Canada shouldn’t allow cargo jet any fatigue rule exemptions since they are trying to use it as a scare tactic and not doing it for science based / specific sector reasons
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notwhoyouthinkIam
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by notwhoyouthinkIam »

DHC-1 Jockey wrote: Fri May 14, 2021 5:57 pm
notwhoyouthinkIam wrote: Fri May 14, 2021 5:26 pm So much good that did.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/busines ... 0sgCjdMOsE
It's behind a paywall I can't read.
If you're using Firefox you can go into reader view and refresh.
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Tdicommuter
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by Tdicommuter »

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Yycjetdriver
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by Yycjetdriver »

Tdicommuter wrote: Sun May 16, 2021 4:24 am https://pilotcareercentre.com/Pilot-Job ... irways-Ltd.


That did not take long.
Still easily could be a scare tactic, pretty easy for them to fire up that ad. Besides, haven’t all the American majors recalled/given recall dates to their Pilots , so it’s unlikely they will get a flood of type rated guys applying. Also if there is even any American Pilots that do apply, chances are they laugh at the offer if Cargojet plans to pay anywhere close to Canadian Pilot pay rates.
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altiplano
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by altiplano »

Tdicommuter wrote: Sun May 16, 2021 4:24 am https://pilotcareercentre.com/Pilot-Job ... irways-Ltd.


That did not take long.
What are they going to do? N register a few aircraft and get a US operating certificate so they can fly aircraft with US contract pilots? Start a new business with new managers and DFOs and CPs and PRMs and everything that goes with it? Won't it will take a while to get FAA approvals etc? All so they can fly their pilots am extra hour here or there? That sure sounds like a money saver...

This looks more like a show to me. Let Virmani have his tantrum.

For good measure, let's see ALPA and DePete follow up on their previous letter of concern and put an advisory out to US pilots to blacklist applications to this position.
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fish4life
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by fish4life »

I get the sense they were planning on doing the US company anyway to try take advantage of the market down there since you can’t do point you point anyway. All the fatigue exemptions in the world can’t change that.

I’m disappointed our regulator hasn’t come out with a statement saying it will not condone this behaviour by cargo jet threatening fatigue rules for jobs.
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Chaxterium
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by Chaxterium »

fish4life wrote: Sun May 16, 2021 7:22 am I’m disappointed our regulator hasn’t come out with a statement saying it will not condone this behaviour by cargo jet threatening fatigue rules for jobs.

What a fucking concept that would be right? They spend years developing new fatigue rules that at least make a modicum of sense scientifically speaking but then give operators the ability to completely ignore these rules? And tell pilots their jobs will be on the line if they don't toe the line? This is disgraceful.
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redbusdriver
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by redbusdriver »

cargojet, the ggn of cargo
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vrefplus5
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by vrefplus5 »

Did CJT buy Amerijet, or take a controlling interest?
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wjawannabe
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Re: ALPA Criticizes Cargojet

Post by wjawannabe »

They have an interest in this company, but the ownership stake is unknown. Fleet of 2 cargo B767, based in MIA and CVG.

https://21air.us/
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