How will you spend your ratification pay?

[Straight2Secondary]

Anyone with half a brain knows this will pass with flying colour's.

Thank you to Charlene for your unwavering leadership. Thank you to the NC for making me one of the highest paid pilots in the world.

30 years to go as a Widebody Captain. For all the junior guys, just raise the gear and zip it, you bunch of entitled babies. It's 2 years, suck it up and vote yes.

[TCAS II]

Now you can spend your money on discount flights.


Obviously there was more money left on the table for the pilots if the company can afford to offer 25% discounts on tickets.


https://nationalpost.com/news/air-canad ... -discounts


Air Canada is offering new deals for customers after the possibility of a pilots’ strike forced many to change travel plans.
On its website, an offer for customers to save 25 per cent on all destinations around the world is being promoted for bookings made today. The travel period must be between Sept. 18 and May 31, 2025. In addition, customers can earn 2,500 bonus Aeroplan points for travel periods starting on Sept. 28 until May 31, 2025.
The 25 per cent discount applies to economy (standard only), and select premium economy lowest and business class lowest, undiscounted Air Canada-published base fares only, per the website. Certain dates are exempt from the deal.
In late August, the airline’s pilots, who are part of the Air Line Pilots Association, Int’l (ALPA) union, voted in favour of a strike for fair pay, better retirement benefits and quality-of-life improvements, according to a news release. Air Canada and its pilots reached a tentative deal by mid-September.

“After several consecutive weeks of intense round-the-clock negotiations, progress was made on several key issues including compensation, retirement, and work rules,” said chair of the Air Canada ALPA MEC First Officer Charlene Hudy.

“This agreement, if ratified by the pilot group, would officially put an end to our outdated and stale decade-old, ten-year framework.”

Customers who changed flights that were booked between Sept. 15 and Sept. 23 to another date before Nov. 30 can switch back to their original booking free of cost if seats are available, Air Canada said in a news release.

While pilots were on the picket line, some customers struggled to reschedule plans and rebook flights. In case a strike did happen, Air Canada started to wind down some of its services, like Air Canada Cargo and vacation packages, the Canadian Press reported on Sept. 12.

As the strike deadline approached, some people took to social media to plead with the airline.

“I’m begging you to please not strike,” wrote on person on X with the handle @otchere_rachel.

With the announcement that a tentative deal had been reached, one customer said they were “glad for the pilots” but upset as a customer.

“Deeply disappointed as a passenger who made the tough call to cancel a wonderful vacation. Shame on you Air Canada for waiting nearly a year to get an agreement. Think I’m about done with you guys,” wrote the person on X with the handle @CurtisD71808722.

Customers are not the only ones who may still take issue with the airline. One expert told CP that the entry-level pay pilots receive in their first four years, before a larger wage increase in year five, might be a problem.

Out of the 5,200 pilots who went on strike, around 2,000 of them could be earning entry-level wages, McGill University’s John Gradek said, CP reported. Gradek is a faculty lecturer and academic program coordinator who teaches aviation management.

There could be “pushback from rank-and-file flight crew” after the failure to ditch pay grade restrictions that could put the deal in jeopardy, he said.

[Dry Guy]

I'm buying AC stock! Gotta pay for my own profit sharing now. Who will match me?

[thepoops]

Anyone with half a brain knows this will pass with flying colour's.

Thank you to Charlene for your unwavering leadership. Thank you to the NC for making me one of the highest paid pilots in the world.

30 years to go as a Widebody Captain. For all the junior guys, just raise the gear and zip it, you bunch of entitled babies. It's 2 years, suck it up and vote yes.

Oh please, this isn't going to pass by a long shot. Shills like you, Charlene, and the NC are trying hard though to push this dumpster fire. Luckily the majority will see the shills for who they are, and will send this TA back until we do get a world class contract!

[Straight2Secondary]

How did Charlene go from being a savior to a shill ?

Where are the resources?

Let's get Joby as the MEC chair, a guy who worked in the US and left..... and can barely string 5 words together intelligently, but but but but - he's an embarsment to our profession and anyone who has played hockey with him knows it.

What lanyard are you going to wear after this gets ratified? What sticker will you put on your bag? So many hard decisions. I'm a world class pilot, where is our world class contract, news flash junior, there is nothing world class about you or how ALPA handled your expectations.

Get to the back of the line and zip it, take your 80k a year and dry your tears with it and pretend like you're worth more, guess what - you aren't and everyone knows it.

[alkaseltzer]

Agree or disagree with those who served in the union…

Everyone should have a black list of those who have publicly berated them on forums and WhatsApp chats with personal attacks.

You will never be allowed in the jumpseat. Not when I operate.

Joby and Charlene and the rest of them are stand up people.
Have respect.

[Allfourseasons]

How did Charlene go from being a savior to a shill ?

Where are the resources?

Let's get Joby as the MEC chair, a guy who worked in the US and left..... and can barely string 5 words together intelligently, but but but but - he's an embarsment to our profession and anyone who has played hockey with him knows it.

What lanyard are you going to wear after this gets ratified? What sticker will you put on your bag? So many hard decisions. I'm a world class pilot, where is our world class contract, news flash junior, there is nothing world class about you or how ALPA handled your expectations.

Get to the back of the line and zip it, take your 80k a year and dry your tears with it and pretend like you're worth more, guess what - you aren't and everyone knows it.

Classy man, your ego is higher than your cruising altitude. Imagine laughing at the JRs as they go through this spirit crushing economy with a PayScale that barely matches 2003 in a world that's anything but 2003.

[Bede]

Anyone with half a brain knows this will pass with flying colour's.

Thank you to Charlene for your unwavering leadership. Thank you to the NC for making me one of the highest paid pilots in the world.

30 years to go as a Widebody Captain. For all the junior guys, just raise the gear and zip it, you bunch of entitled babies. It's 2 years, suck it up and vote yes.

Oh please, this isn't going to pass by a long shot. Shills like you, Charlene, and the NC are trying hard though to push this dumpster fire. Luckily the majority will see the shills for who they are, and will send this TA back until we do get a world class contract!

So this is precisely the type of comment that results in a union having difficulty attracting qualified people to run high profile roles such as MEC chair and NC. You got a TA with a sizeable raise, that, unfortunately, doesn't work that well for you. Go ahead vote no- that's your right. But you go further and impugn the integrity of your colleagues who spent the last year or two sacrificing for the betterment of our profession. Grow up.

[pipedream?]

How did Charlene go from being a savior to a shill ?

Where are the resources?

Let's get Joby as the MEC chair, a guy who worked in the US and left..... and can barely string 5 words together intelligently, but but but but - he's an embarsment to our profession and anyone who has played hockey with him knows it.

What lanyard are you going to wear after this gets ratified? What sticker will you put on your bag? So many hard decisions. I'm a world class pilot, where is our world class contract, news flash junior, there is nothing world class about you or how ALPA handled your expectations.

Get to the back of the line and zip it, take your 80k a year and dry your tears with it and pretend like you're worth more, guess what - you aren't and everyone knows it.

Jesus dude…

[digits_]

Anyone with half a brain knows this will pass with flying colour's.

Thank you to Charlene for your unwavering leadership. Thank you to the NC for making me one of the highest paid pilots in the world.

30 years to go as a Widebody Captain. For all the junior guys, just raise the gear and zip it, you bunch of entitled babies. It's 2 years, suck it up and vote yes.

Oh please, this isn't going to pass by a long shot. Shills like you, Charlene, and the NC are trying hard though to push this dumpster fire. Luckily the majority will see the shills for who they are, and will send this TA back until we do get a world class contract!

So this is precisely the type of comment that results in a union having difficulty attracting qualified people to run high profile roles such as MEC chair and NC. You got a TA with a sizeable raise, that, unfortunately, doesn't work that well for you. Go ahead vote no- that's your right. But you go further and impugn the integrity of your colleagues who spent the last year or two sacrificing for the betterment of our profession. Grow up.

I don't know Bede. I generally like to give people the benefit of the doubt, and I dislike name-calling and insults. But respect goes both ways. I don't think offering your colleagues only 20 to 25% of your own salary shows much respect towards them either.

Perhaps this backlash and strong words will have the expected effect, as you indicate, and will prevent these particular individuals from being involved in the union. Or it might cause other negotiators to think twice before selling out the junior pilots once again in the next round.

No matter how you spin this, the negotiating pilots got themselves a raise that is higher than their junior colleagues' entire salary. They shouldn't be surprised that generates some strong reactions.

[altiplano]

Seems to me that a senior Delta CA makes about 4X or more what a first year pilot does there.

I'm voting No all the same because I believe we could get more by going back, but the hyperbole on guys apparently getting the shaft here by senior guys is way off. If you've been a junior guy getting the shaft you know that this isn't it. That's when there are grandfathered rates you can't get, and B-scales that you get stuck on. Remember that all that you see that is better is where everyone gets an opportunity to go and sooner than before. Always would like to see better, but this isn't senior shafting junior.

I flew with a junior second year guy earlier this week starting CA training coming up this fall... he's voting Yes. He's pretty ecstatic that he's going to make $300K in his third year. He's 25 years old.

I love Charlene and Joby. I hope our whole crew stays on. I'll be disappointed if they bail on a No vote.

[bcflyer]

He’s going to be disappointed. Nobody is making $300,000 in their 3rd year.

[CaptDukeNukem]

He’s going to be disappointed. Nobody is making $300,000 in their 3rd year.

The trouble is that the math is already done in the kid’s head. Dollar signs in the eyes. No turning back now.

[bcflyer]

He’s going to be disappointed. Nobody is making $300,000 in their 3rd year.

The trouble is that the math is already done in the kid’s head. Dollar signs in the eyes. No turning back now.

Very true. I fly with a lot of very junior guys/gals and always try to impress on them the value of QOL articles in the contract. Some get it. Others don’t. Unfortunately when he realizes not only will he not make $300,00 but he’s also working far more with terrible QOL it will be too late.

[cdnavater]

He’s going to be disappointed. Nobody is making $300,000 in their 3rd year.

I’m not sure why you think they won’t, 220 Captain is 279.93/hr at 1000 hours, 83.33 block hours per month is 279918.80.
Not terribly hard to make an extra 20k, given VO, draft and training outside the block get a premium of 100%, 20k is 35 of OT for an entire year, 8 days at min credit, seems very likely to me.

[bcflyer]

On paper maybe. In reality it will be a stretch.

[altiplano]

He’s going to be disappointed. Nobody is making $300,000 in their 3rd year.

$285/hr... bit of training... a bit of premium/override... max esop match... that's easy $300K.

[bcflyer]

He’s going to be disappointed. Nobody is making $300,000 in their 3rd year.

$285/hr... bit of training... a bit of premium/override... max esop match... that's easy $300K.

ESOP match is not pay. That’s an investment. Working overtime doesn’t count. Anyone can work overtime and earn more. The fact that people will bitch about working too many days then count on doing overtime to achieve some magical number defeats the whole point of trying to achieve QOL gains.

[Straight2.Secondary]

Hey everyone,

Sorry about that outburst. I am going through a rough patch...found my lady bobbing my neighbor's 2 apples. Really upsetting stuff.

Anyhow...I am voting yes because of the extra mental health coverage in the deal. I need it.

Again, sorry everyone.

In unity

[altiplano]

He’s going to be disappointed. Nobody is making $300,000 in their 3rd year.

$285/hr... bit of training... a bit of premium/override... max esop match... that's easy $300K.

ESOP match is not pay. That’s an investment. Working overtime doesn’t count. Anyone can work overtime and earn more. The fact that people will bitch about working too many days then count on doing overtime to achieve some magical number defeats the whole point of trying to achieve QOL gains.

I don't disagree on your QOL statement, but the point is there are a lot of paths to 300K @285/hr and it's a damn short path to get there. Other than per diems, taxable income whatever you want to call it is pay.

And this airline certainly isn't an investment! Get your match and get out.

[cdnavater]

He’s going to be disappointed. Nobody is making $300,000 in their 3rd year.

$285/hr... bit of training... a bit of premium/override... max esop match... that's easy $300K.

ESOP match is not pay. That’s an investment. Working overtime doesn’t count. Anyone can work overtime and earn more. The fact that people will bitch about working too many days then count on doing overtime to achieve some magical number defeats the whole point of trying to achieve QOL gains.

Seems like you’re just digging in now, how is ESOP match not income, I can tell you the CRA counts it as income.
When the company matches, I sell it all unless the stock is down a bit but it’s certainly not a long term investment, it’s just a savings that the company has to pony up.
Also, on the most junior equipment, 8 days of OT for an entire year, seriously, don’t you guys train every four months, that’ll either be at double time or in the block, either way it’s a win.
Just admit you were wrong, you just sound silly now

[RippleRock]

I would have liked nothing more than sending a big FU in the form of a strike. Nothing more, but the ideal time was last week.

It's GONE.

Now unity is fracturing, we have a split MEC, a leader who is threatening resignation AND voting yes, Brad Ridge running legal, Dumb and Dumber as negotiating leads.

How exactly is a NO vote going to benefit us??? I, among all of us WISH it would. Reality may be very different.

The first thing the company is going to do is shift money around at no cost to them. The second is they remove ratification pay, because they can. The third thing they will do is call their cronies in government to force arbitration, as "negotiations aren't going well, and the union is a mess and leaderless right now". Watch.

I can't fathom how anyone thinks Ralph, Evans and our "crack legal" BR are going to follow an ultimatum from the Membership and "just go get more". HOW? They didn't do it before when everything was tight and focused. Some seem to think that somehow the "will of the Membership" is going to cause some "seismic shift" that didn't occur before the 14th??? We had a 98% strike mandate for chrissake. That's NOT something you pitch in the bin....but our MEC did exactly that. Chew on that for a moment.

At best, there will be a 55% no vote. This will also be used as a club to force arbitration.


Frankly we are in a tight corner. The company knows it, the bulk of the Membership knows it, and the Minister of Labour knows it.


FWIW, The thing that really hurts is that Charlene is going to nullify MY no vote. What an unbelievable kick in the nuts.

[PA-18]

IMHO I can’t believe the etiquette on this public forum and the lack of professionalism. World class… where’s the popcorn

[AirCandida]

IMHO I can’t believe the etiquette on this public forum and the lack of professionalism. World class… where’s the popcorn

The lack of professionalism started with the MEC and their betrayal. What you see is the frustration it caused. Side note, Boeing IAW rejected their first offer and just been offered more. Every group who rejected the first TA in recent years received more on the 2nd, yet here we have a MEC that waved the white flag before the battle started.

[RochVoisine]

And a MEC attempting to muddy the waters with the drama of her resignation. Truly a horrific turn in leadership.