Not sure what to do...
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Not sure what to do...
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Last edited by ThatOneCanadianEh on Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Not sure what to do...
My advice -
Always keep a "rainy day" fund. Set aside a bit of that money you have saved and don't touch it until you really need it. And trust me, if you want to be a pilot, you will need it someday.
Also, the best thing you can do is train in an occupation that is in demand. You can use it to supplement the flying income in the first 10 years of your aviation career.
Good luck. You seem to have it figured out.
Always keep a "rainy day" fund. Set aside a bit of that money you have saved and don't touch it until you really need it. And trust me, if you want to be a pilot, you will need it someday.
Also, the best thing you can do is train in an occupation that is in demand. You can use it to supplement the flying income in the first 10 years of your aviation career.
Good luck. You seem to have it figured out.
Re: Not sure what to do...
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Last edited by flatface on Fri May 30, 2014 10:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Not sure what to do...
Thanks for posting!
It sounds like you already have a clear outline of your options, however I'd say the most important thing is to be as informed as possible. The more you know about your options, the better educated decision you can make walking in. Realize that aviation is a tough road to go down, and that the high majority of us do it for the love, not the money.
If you are looking the flying way, get to know your options on training, flight school pros and cons (each) and the potential routes for jobs. Don't believe everything the local school tells you, usually they have a way of wanting you to spend more money their way (ex. you can do your Multi and IFR before finishing your commercial.) Airline flying is not the end all be all. There's guys on here that run twin otters all day, or spray, do aerial firefighting. some guys run the air taxi and commuter routes and love it. The money varies wildly throughout.
I would suggest that if your passion is absolutely strong and you can't stop thinking about being off the ground, then go for it. Yes, loans are tough. I'm still paying mine off, but I figure I'm putting an investment in myself. Determination and perseverance will get that loan paid off.
If you absolutely love IT, and it can bring you a more stable, higher paying job, then perhaps this is the route. My suggestion would be to sit down with pilots who've gone through the system in the past 10 years and some IT guys who have as well. Interview them, get a wide sample group, see what the real guys say. Educational institutions can deceive you. Get the real story, and make the best potential informed decision you can.
Finally, if you like both, but can only choose one, perhaps that's ok. I'm not sure if you can do IT on the side at all, but I know a lot of guys who go flying on the weekends, fly ultralights or go soaring. They still get their fix, and work in all parts of the economy, all around the world.
It sounds like you already have a clear outline of your options, however I'd say the most important thing is to be as informed as possible. The more you know about your options, the better educated decision you can make walking in. Realize that aviation is a tough road to go down, and that the high majority of us do it for the love, not the money.
If you are looking the flying way, get to know your options on training, flight school pros and cons (each) and the potential routes for jobs. Don't believe everything the local school tells you, usually they have a way of wanting you to spend more money their way (ex. you can do your Multi and IFR before finishing your commercial.) Airline flying is not the end all be all. There's guys on here that run twin otters all day, or spray, do aerial firefighting. some guys run the air taxi and commuter routes and love it. The money varies wildly throughout.
I would suggest that if your passion is absolutely strong and you can't stop thinking about being off the ground, then go for it. Yes, loans are tough. I'm still paying mine off, but I figure I'm putting an investment in myself. Determination and perseverance will get that loan paid off.
If you absolutely love IT, and it can bring you a more stable, higher paying job, then perhaps this is the route. My suggestion would be to sit down with pilots who've gone through the system in the past 10 years and some IT guys who have as well. Interview them, get a wide sample group, see what the real guys say. Educational institutions can deceive you. Get the real story, and make the best potential informed decision you can.
Finally, if you like both, but can only choose one, perhaps that's ok. I'm not sure if you can do IT on the side at all, but I know a lot of guys who go flying on the weekends, fly ultralights or go soaring. They still get their fix, and work in all parts of the economy, all around the world.
Re: Not sure what to do...
Don't let them tell you that you can't fly with Colour Blindness . I have been flying Commercially for 40 years now Day VFR is a great way to make a living.
On the plus side you are home at night or at the very least on the ground and are on call only during the day and that means you have all nights to sleep.
On the minus side it stops you from getting your Airline Transport Rating as you cannot get any legal night time.
Regards Beechnut
On the plus side you are home at night or at the very least on the ground and are on call only during the day and that means you have all nights to sleep.
On the minus side it stops you from getting your Airline Transport Rating as you cannot get any legal night time.
Regards Beechnut
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Re: Not sure what to do...
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Last edited by ThatOneCanadianEh on Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Not sure what to do...
If you like computers, you might want to explore a career in avionics and avionics repair...
There are lots of options, few with guaranteed job/income at the end. If I was 17 years old and had $30K saved for education, I'd buy a 152 and pursue the licensing in my own plane. When you're done, you can sell it. Yes, there's a risk, but there's a huge reward. I'd love to fly across the country, in anything, even a 152 (maybe not a J3 though...).
Military is a great idea too. I know a few people in the Canadian Forces and they love it. None of them are pilots thought.
Good luck!
There are lots of options, few with guaranteed job/income at the end. If I was 17 years old and had $30K saved for education, I'd buy a 152 and pursue the licensing in my own plane. When you're done, you can sell it. Yes, there's a risk, but there's a huge reward. I'd love to fly across the country, in anything, even a 152 (maybe not a J3 though...).
Military is a great idea too. I know a few people in the Canadian Forces and they love it. None of them are pilots thought.
Good luck!
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Re: Not sure what to do...
+1 sort of...I have red/green colour deficiency and an unrestricted cat 1 medical and no hinderance to the atpl...certain tests can possibly help remove conditionsbeechnut wrote:Don't let them tell you that you can't fly with Colour Blindness . I have been flying Commercially for 40 years now Day VFR is a great way to make a living.
On the plus side you are home at night or at the very least on the ground and are on call only during the day and that means you have all nights to sleep.
On the minus side it stops you from getting your Airline Transport Rating as you cannot get any legal night time.
Regards Beechnut
Re: Not sure what to do...
I wouldn't be too worried about coming out and oweing a bit of money. The way I look at it is get your training finished now while the industry isn't too bad. Federeral and provincial student loans have very reasonable interest rates (I.e. NL provincial loans are interest free) and can be paid out over a fairly long time. Of course if it isn't going to slow you down much, finishing school debt free is always great. On the other hand don't rack up 40 grand worth of loans. That may put you in a pickle. Just my 2 cents.
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Re: Not sure what to do...
I wouldn't bother with BCIT or the like. If you want a diploma for the resume get something that would be useful outside aviation as a hedge against losing your medical in the future. An overpriced aviation centric BCIT diploma does not meet the criteria. Two years is a long time without income as well, factor that in. I did my CPL and Class IV and was working in less than a year. Guys who were going into the diploma program when I started were handing me their resumes for the CFI and I already had my Class III and building time.ThatOneCanadianEh wrote: ...One of my options is to go to BCIT to do a 2 year technology diploma, so I can get a somewhat descent job in the IT field and work full time while doing my flight training on my days off. However, due to the intensity of BCIT's IT course, i will not be able to hold a part time job during my 2 years of schooling.
My other option is to start flight training right away, but as I do not have sufficient funds for all the ratings (PPL CPL MEIR), I will have to work part time, and most likely take out a loan, which I absolutely dread. (I have heard of some horror stories from going down this route)...
I went the trades route and saved up all the cash I needed to jump into the industry. Came out with a skill to fall back on and no debt. The no debt part is important because you will not make enough to service debt when you start out. Have a decent reliable car that is paid off too...
Good luck. I wouldn't do it again FWIW. I would get a decent job and fly for fun. You'll know why when you are de-icing some clapped out bird at 4am in the freezing cold. You will be longing for a nice warm cubicle job then.

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Re: Not sure what to do...
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Last edited by ThatOneCanadianEh on Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Not sure what to do...
You and a million other high school graduates.ThatOneCanadianEh wrote:The funny thing is, I am really good with computers (Right now I hold a Comptia A+ Computer Technician Certification, and a CCNA for networking) I did this all in grade 10 of highschool...
I was in IT for over 20 years, mainly servers, networks and programming. Had all of the alphabet after my name. Went through the major companies, including big blue, until I ended up at a great small company I thought I'd retire from. Fast forward a few years and I'm out on my ass due to a restructuring. Should be easy to find a job with loads of experience, right?
Most people that hire geeks don't have a clue about the job. As long as they see letters after a name, that person must be qualified. They don't understand why one person wants 20k a year when the other wants 60k for the same job. Because they are clueless about the job, mistakes are easy to cover, meaning a junior tech can BS his way out of negligence.
The end result is you'll forever be competing with kids that know everything about computers, living in their parents basements who will work for peanuts just so they don't have to get their hands dirty. (sounds like aviation) The IT boom is long over. So unless you like the job for the job and not for the money, like daycare workers, pilots or mechanics, its a terrible way to make a living. I'm glad I got out while I was young enough for a career change.
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Re: Not sure what to do...
For what its worth:You have the money to get started. Go to the airports and talk to anyone that will talk. Learn all you can. Talk to mechanics too and get the basics on how airplanes work. Find others with like goals. After a while you will be able to sort out the facts from the BS. Buddy up with another straight shooter or 2 and buy an airplane with all the best advice that you have learned. This is where that mechanic comes in! He might be able to point you to an airplane the he knows over the years that was well maintained; abd that the owner has lost his medical or... Maybe a great deal??? Learn to fly on this and when you get a solo permit---- fly the bag off it. HOURS HOURS HOURS. Go places. There is always someone around an airport that has experience to share; take them flying and learn. Go places!. Keep a good street job to pay for the Gas and..... When you have about 3 to 5 hundred hours. do the commercial thing and so on. The learning curve will be not as steep. Have fun!!!!
BH
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Re: Not sure what to do...
Why not in a J3?I'd love to fly across the country, in anything, even a 152 (maybe not a J3 though...).
Re: Not sure what to do...
I spent 26 hours in a 65HP J3 flying from Southern Ontario to OshKosh and back this summer. I'm not quite ready to fly from Southern Ontario to Victoria, BC in a J3 just yet. My a$$ was sore on day two. Maybe, if I had no timeline and could meander, I'd be into it. Not that a 152 would be faster...Cat Driver wrote:Why not in a J3?I'd love to fly across the country, in anything, even a 152 (maybe not a J3 though...).
I'll never forget the day the GPS said I was cruising at 90 KT/hr ground speed - best tailwind ever after 4 days at 55 KT.
Great times though, truly great times.
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Re: Not sure what to do...
I guess what I was driving at is if you are time building the speed the thing flys at is irrevelent.
What does matter though is the quality of pilot you end up being and for sure you will be a better pilot flying a J3 than if you only fly a C152.
What does matter though is the quality of pilot you end up being and for sure you will be a better pilot flying a J3 than if you only fly a C152.
Re: Not sure what to do...
As Good ol Stevie tombstone sang.. I've been down that rocky road..
Pick a solid trade.. maybe become a plumber or power engineer, pipefitter, electrician or the likes. Come out of 2-3yr programs with a reasonable paying trades job. THEN being only 21.. fly on weekends with the good money you're making and finish off the CPL. Then when you're pissed with your shitty paying navajo or king air job.. you can make some coin on the side, you know put some bread on the table! barring that, head back into the trade and fly for fun. Because I'm going to tell you its not all sunshine and roses.
Remember, the supposed be all and end all in aviation (which I disagree with) is an airline.. like our national carrier. AC. Guess what.. it takes between 5-10 years to get there, guess what the starting wage is?! less than 40k/yr. A manager at Rotten ronnies makes more with less responsibility and experience.
Listen to the folk who have advised you to go to the trades. Be home every night! Make decent money! Live where you want to love! Enjoy your life outside of work. Save up and buy and airplane and fly FOR FUN, and enjoy the shit out of it.
Pick a solid trade.. maybe become a plumber or power engineer, pipefitter, electrician or the likes. Come out of 2-3yr programs with a reasonable paying trades job. THEN being only 21.. fly on weekends with the good money you're making and finish off the CPL. Then when you're pissed with your shitty paying navajo or king air job.. you can make some coin on the side, you know put some bread on the table! barring that, head back into the trade and fly for fun. Because I'm going to tell you its not all sunshine and roses.
Remember, the supposed be all and end all in aviation (which I disagree with) is an airline.. like our national carrier. AC. Guess what.. it takes between 5-10 years to get there, guess what the starting wage is?! less than 40k/yr. A manager at Rotten ronnies makes more with less responsibility and experience.
Listen to the folk who have advised you to go to the trades. Be home every night! Make decent money! Live where you want to love! Enjoy your life outside of work. Save up and buy and airplane and fly FOR FUN, and enjoy the shit out of it.
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Re: Not sure what to do...
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Last edited by ThatOneCanadianEh on Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Not sure what to do...
+1 - Everyone should learn to drag tail.Cat Driver wrote:I guess what I was driving at is if you are time building the speed the thing flys at is irrevelent.
What does matter though is the quality of pilot you end up being and for sure you will be a better pilot flying a J3 than if you only fly a C152.
Re: Not sure what to do...
ThatOneCanadianEh wrote:Hey guys! Long time lurker here, finally decided to join in on the fun.
I have wanted to become an airline pilot ever since I was a kid (I think grade 3), right now i'm 17 years old, and will be graduating HS this year. I have now worked for a little more then 2 years at a part-time call center after school and on weekends, and saved every penny I could. I estimate by the time I graduate I will have total 30,000CAD (6,000 of that from my parents RESP) stowed away. My parents are quite supportive, although they are not able to help me much in terms of tuition, I can stay at home for free as long as I want to, and they will take care of my food/internet/etc.
One of my options is to go to BCIT to do a 2 year technology diploma, so I can get a somewhat descent job in the IT field and work full time while doing my flight training on my days off. However, due to the intensity of BCIT's IT course, i will not be able to hold a part time job during my 2 years of schooling.
My other option is to start flight training right away, but as I do not have sufficient funds for all the ratings (PPL CPL MEIR), I will have to work part time, and most likely take out a loan, which I absolutely dread. (I have heard of some horror stories from going down this route)
And before everybody says it, yes I know i'm stupid for even considering wanting to be a pilot, i am well aware of the bleak job prospects afterwards, and yes I know it will be a lot of work.
Currently, I am more leaning towards the first option, but I would love to hear the feedback from the aviation community here! Also, I would like to know how hard It is to get a Cat 1 Medical, fortunately I am blessed with having been healthy my whole life, with no conditions, etc. (Except I am a bit overweight lol, but i'm working on that!) I wouldn't have an issue with this right?
I have the solution for you! Go to BCIT, NAIT or SAIT, get a 2 year degree in Petroleum Technology, drilling is the one that pays the most, specially Horizontal drilling, work in that field and make over $100.00 per hour, Horizontal you can triple that...
You seem to have your head screwed in right, possibly in 10 years you will start your own Oil & Gas Services Co. by then you'll be able to buy an Eclipse jet for half a million so you can take you family to Vegas.
Or you could go to MRU and do the 4 year Pilot program, and in 8 years youll be hired by someone flying a Citation for some rich guy, a few steps up from being a Bus Driver on the Hastings route, definetlly more excitting!, except the the guy on the Hastings route sleeps at home every night.
Nothing that you will want to achieve will come easy, don't get overwhelmed, break down in small chunks, and it will be easier to achieve, when I was your age I was carrying lumber for carpenters at the Court House project in Downtown Vancouver, most of the time in the rain, had a wife pregnant and Elvis Presley died, and no money in the Bank.
If nothing that we have suggested makes any sense, and you find yourself confused,,,,JUST FOLLOW YOU HEART! Good Luck Youngman

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Re: Not sure what to do...
Before you decide to start a career in aviation, PLEASE do yourself a favor and watch at least a season Ice Pilots NWT.
The road from that first fam flight to that elusive airline job is a long, expensive and often thankless journey.
Make sure you enjoy flying as well, go down to the local flying club and do a fam flight to make sure you enjoy flying.
Read through these forums and really make sure you get a good understanding of what's involved in "making it" in aviation. Understand that the piloting profession (in terms of wages and work conditions) is in decline. Did you know that even after years (10+ in many cases) of experience an entry level Air Canada F/O makes just over $40,000 a year? Also, consider the nature of the airline business. Lots of bankruptcies, downsizing, layoffs, base closures, etc, etc.
I don't want to sound negative, but there are too many people who have sunk tens of thousands of dollars into a dream that either doesn't materialize or they finally realize is a nightmare but it's too late.
The road from that first fam flight to that elusive airline job is a long, expensive and often thankless journey.
Make sure you enjoy flying as well, go down to the local flying club and do a fam flight to make sure you enjoy flying.
Read through these forums and really make sure you get a good understanding of what's involved in "making it" in aviation. Understand that the piloting profession (in terms of wages and work conditions) is in decline. Did you know that even after years (10+ in many cases) of experience an entry level Air Canada F/O makes just over $40,000 a year? Also, consider the nature of the airline business. Lots of bankruptcies, downsizing, layoffs, base closures, etc, etc.
I don't want to sound negative, but there are too many people who have sunk tens of thousands of dollars into a dream that either doesn't materialize or they finally realize is a nightmare but it's too late.
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Re: Not sure what to do...
Lots of good points on here, but here are a few more.
-I'm not sure I can agree that aviation is in decline. A job at AC may not be what it used to be, but then it isn't the only airline job out there. The future is in the East - Middle and Far.
-The starting pay at AC isn't really indicative of the career pay. Even at the shittier wages they make now. Both WS and AC pay crap for years one and two. And other airlines use bonds. Whatever. You have to amortize the pay over the projected career.
-Instability, layoffs, downsizing, etc are factors that face pretty much all industries, if not at present, eventually. I've always said a pilot's job isn't flying airplanes, it's finding his next flying job.
-Most trades that involve any kind of manual labour aren't really possible to do until retirement age, which is only going higher. (A 67 year old pipefitter? Not common.) And trades will be "offshored" by bringing in lower-paid foreign workers, much like manufacturing was given to the lowest cost labour overseas.
My two bits of advice: avoid debt at all costs, even if it means a longer timeline to your goal. And be adaptable.
-I'm not sure I can agree that aviation is in decline. A job at AC may not be what it used to be, but then it isn't the only airline job out there. The future is in the East - Middle and Far.
-The starting pay at AC isn't really indicative of the career pay. Even at the shittier wages they make now. Both WS and AC pay crap for years one and two. And other airlines use bonds. Whatever. You have to amortize the pay over the projected career.
-Instability, layoffs, downsizing, etc are factors that face pretty much all industries, if not at present, eventually. I've always said a pilot's job isn't flying airplanes, it's finding his next flying job.
-Most trades that involve any kind of manual labour aren't really possible to do until retirement age, which is only going higher. (A 67 year old pipefitter? Not common.) And trades will be "offshored" by bringing in lower-paid foreign workers, much like manufacturing was given to the lowest cost labour overseas.
My two bits of advice: avoid debt at all costs, even if it means a longer timeline to your goal. And be adaptable.
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Re: Not sure what to do...
They are, but the general plan of a trade is to eventually be overseeing others new to your trade, most of the time by running a business yourself. Things aren't the same as they used to be, though, my father worked as a mechanic until he retired, my grandfather held his welding ticket and drove truck until he was 65, but these were tougher men than is typical these days. These men worked in camps in their youth, which were litterally camps - in tents.-Most trades that involve any kind of manual labour aren't really possible to do until retirement age, which is only going higher.
I wouldn't necessarily say that, but to each their own. In this day and age debt sometimes is necessary if one wants to get ahead. If you think anyone ever went rags to riches strictly by hard work from the bottom up without some sort of investment this way, well you've got another thing comming. If you must do it, manage it well.avoid debt at all costs,
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Re: Not sure what to do...
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Last edited by ThatOneCanadianEh on Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Not sure what to do...
That's exactly what this is about. Getting your fix. Am I the only one that goes 1 day without flying and all of a sudden finds himself lurking around an airport just waiting to be back in the air again ?Masters Off wrote:
They still get their fix, and work in all parts of the economy, all around the world.