First Air off course

[Meddler]

Lots of the approaches up north don't work with the stabalized constant desent criteria on the new plates. I only meant to show where their position and heading was confirm as opposed to projected.

[GyvAir]

Ah.. thanks, Meddler. I misread your intentions.
I had wondered why the projected track met the radar track somewhere midway between first radar contact and YFB. Looking at the track log, you can see that it alternates back and forth between projected and actual positions for a while and the projected line is an average of the two from the time of first radar contact until all the positions logged are actual.

[ditar]

Maybe they were flying visually and mistook Cumberland Sound for Frobisher Bay.

[Liquid Charlie]

Ah.. thanks, Meddler. I misread your intentions.
I had wondered why the projected track met the radar track somewhere midway between first radar contact and YFB. Looking at the track log, you can see that it alternates back and forth between projected and actual positions for a while and the projected line is an average of the two from the time of first radar contact until all the positions logged are actual.

Because there is no radar coverage from Rankin until you are within range of Frob -- I'm wondering if North Bay gave centre a "heads up"

[Donald]

Lots of the approaches up north don't work with the stabalized constant desent criteria on the new plates.

Which ones?

[GyvAir]

Because there is no radar coverage from Rankin until you are within range of Frob -- I'm wondering if North Bay gave centre a "heads up"

They could have been in radar range for a while before they turned south, going by this map. Kind of skirting along the edge of North Bay's range as well.

Radar.JPG (113.6 KiB) Viewed 2134 times

[Meddler]

Meddler wrote:
Lots of the approaches up north don't work with the stabalized constant desent criteria on the new plates.


"Which ones? "

Most of the non precisions with mountains around. It says so on the plates, the ones where it doesn't work don't show a constant desent path. I have no idea where this would be the case in the eastern arctic tho

[Changes in Latitudes]

Meddler wrote:
Lots of the approaches up north don't work with the stabilized constant desCent criteria on the new plates.


"Which ones? "

Most of the non precisions with mountains around. It says so on the plates, the ones where it doesn't work don't show a constant desCent path. I have no idea where this would be the case in the eastern arctic tho

Try CYXP CYVM CYIO...not that it has anything to do with this thread.
"As you get closer to Greenland, the landscape starts looking more like Greenland".

Eastern Arctic:

[Liquid Charlie]

Kind of skirting along the edge of North Bay's range as well.
Attachment:

What is showing on the picture is secondary radar -- the primary radar has more coverage but sometime they are reluctant you intervene -- before the days of GPS you were more likely to get a friendly nudge from one of the DEW line sites -- been there done that -- LFAOOOOO -- outbound in the procedure at Clyde River a 160 -- - on one occasion --

[55+]

Lots of the approaches up north don't work with the stabalized constant desent criteria on the new plates. I only meant to show where their position and heading was confirm as opposed to projected.

If I may............ what design criteria do you base that statement on.

[Donald]

Try CYXP CYVM CYIO...not that it has anything to do with this thread.

Exactly.

[Illya Kuryakin]

Try CYXP CYVM CYIO...not that it has anything to do with this thread.

Exactly.

It was a very nice photo however. Keep up the good work there Changes....
Illya

[Changes in Latitudes]

Try CYXP CYVM CYIO...not that it has anything to do with this thread.

Exactly.

It was a very nice photo however. Keep up the good work there Changes....
Illya

You too...it's always good to meet a fan.

[Meddler]

Ya nice photo. What a place eh? Hope I get to fly there someday.

"If I may............ what design criteria do you base that statement on. "

I don't design anything. I just read the plates.

[ragbagflyer]

I wish I was joking but...somebody just get these guys a bunch of garmin 296's or something.

[leftoftrack]

Stable approach criteria will differ with each operator but ours is. the last thousand feet ifr or the last 500 feet vfr. The aircraft must be configured with flaps and gear set for landing decent rate of no more than 1000'/min minor corrections only on the heading no more than half scale defection on a loc or g/s airspeed within 5 knots above target 0knots below

[triplese7en]

Lots of the approaches up north don't work with the stabalized constant desent criteria on the new plates. I only meant to show where their position and heading was confirm as opposed to projected.

If I may............ what design criteria do you base that statement on.

TP 308... Just like every approach in Canada.

[55+]

Lots of the approaches up north don't work with the stabalized constant desent criteria on the new plates. I only meant to show where their position and heading was confirm as opposed to projected.

If I may............ what design criteria do you base that statement on.

TP 308... Just like every approach in Canada.

You qualified to do design work referencing TP-308....

[FICU]

Update and a few answers...

http://www.cbc.ca/m/touch/canada/north/story/1.2602050

[MrWings]

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz ... What, I thought you were watching?

No, I just closed my eyes for a second .....

[Illya Kuryakin]

The crew has been suspended "with pay"....okay then.
Illya

[CFR]

I'll kill this now while there is still some sanity.
The CADOR's was really badly written by a person that has never been in an airplane more than likely...
The flight was a few miles off track (+/- 8-10) not as assumed reading a really badly worded report. They were a couple of hundred miles northwest of Iqaluit where the deviation was detected. A reportable AOR in the world of NavCan.

Witch hunt over.

Good night.

So where did your info come from?

[A346Dude]

“We have learned that there was no threat to the safety of the passengers and crew on board and the flight landed safely without further incident,” the statement reads.

Apparently being 200km off course is no big deal

Just because they had enough extra fuel this time, and didn't happen to cross the path of another aircraft, doesn't mean there was no threat.

[swordfish]

There are some anomalies in the reporting of the aircraft's position when it turned southeast to Iqaluit.

The CBC first reported it was 165 km off track.
The CADOR initially says 165 nm
In the CADOR update, it says 225 nm
Going by Google Earth, the start of the green track line to YFB is about 158 nm (going by the co-ordinates fixed by the time it turned southeast, at 14:38)

After 1:30 approx in flight, isn't one dude saying to the other dude: "Hey dude, we've been going for an hour-&-a-half; we should be landing in like 12 minutes. Is it time for a D-&-A check, make a plan, and speak to the man?" ....like 20 minutes ago...

[swordfish]

"Hey dude. Look at our ADF - it's really fucked up. It shows the Dorset beacon off to the right."

"Yeah, it did the same going by Coral. We'll have to snag it."