Kenn Borek or Perimeter Aviation?

[P14t00n]

Given the two choices of Kenn Borek or Perimeter aviation, which one should I choose given I would be starting on the ground for both.

couple things that concerns me are:
1) Time it takes to go from ground to flight line
2) Time it takes to go from FO to left seat
3) Flight time of each company, will I be getting my hours
4) Will I be getting the requirements to get my ATPL
5) Where do the captains go when they leave the company? Do they go straight to a regional or do they have to go somewhere else

Any other information or reasoning is greatly appreciated!

thanks!!!

[Meatservo]

Kenn Borek.

I will be the stereotypical wet-blanket type of old person here. You have asked all the wrong questions. You young fellers always want to rush headlong into the very first job you can get that gives you the coveted "captain" position. Well there are captains and then there are Captains. If you spend the earlier part of your career doing things the hard way, it will pay off down the road in spades. I recommend Kenn Borek. I recommend telling them you want the hardest, dirtiest job you can get. I recommend learning to fly a plane using the manual flight controls, over and over again year-in and year-out until you're genuinely better at steering the ship than the god-damned flight guidance computer. I recommend learning how to look up to senior pilots, rather than just taking the quickest way to having the same uniform as they do. I recommend learning how to navigate. I recommend flying in different places around the world. I recommend learning some humility and some wisdom before presuming to be the "pilot in command" of a ship that has innocent people in it. I recommend not letting ambition make a mockery of your purposeful toil. Live a life you can be proud of.

Or take the easy way. Whatever.

[Jean-Pierre]

Perimeter captain go to Air Canada. Kenn Borek captain go to Kenn Borek.

[Maritimer]

Borek, just because they aren't run by EIC.

[dune]

Borek.

Remember, its the journey, not the destination.

[Brantford Beech Boy]

couple things that concerns me are:
1) Time it takes to go from ground to flight line
2) Time it takes to go from FO to left seat
3) Flight time of each company, will I be getting my hours
4) Will I be getting the requirements to get my ATPL
5) Where do the captains go when they leave the company? Do they go straight to a regional or do they have to go somewhere else

That's a lot of concern.

I don't know PAG.

but here at KBAL:
1) depends on need. can be as high as 1 year and as low as 1 month. Current crop (depending on individual aptitude and attitude) will probably see the flightline in under 6 months

2)depends on how much time you come with and which airplane you ppc on. Min time for the left seat here is 2500 TT. Hard number.

3)depends on which airplane you ppc on. Baslers, Twotter and BE20 sked fly lots. BE20 medevac less.

4)depends on the answer to question #3. We do have a PICUS program, so it would not be an issue when you get the required time

5)Borek is the a lot like "Hotel California"...you can check out anytime you like, but you can never leave....


Cheers
BBB

[PROC_HDG]

Perimeter captain go to Air Canada. Kenn Borek captain go to Kenn Borek.

Not unless they go to Jazz, Sky, Georgian or EVAS first.

PROC_HDG

[PROC_HDG]

Borek, just because they aren't run by EIC.

A few years ago my opinion would have been different, but now, ^+1

Of course, I would go to whichever job called first. If you have the luxury of choosing between 2 job offers, you can't really go wrong.

PROC_HDG

[AvExpress]

Borek. They don't have metros

[Yup]

Borek. They don't have metros

Metrosexuals?

[tipsails]

Kenn Borek will have much faster times to get into an aircraft. Those I've know who have gone through the ranks there ranged from 4-8 months (one was closer to a year) of dispatch before being put in a plane.

Perimeter on the other hand... well... yeah. Two years+. Also in my opinion you'll learn a lot more at Borek. 250 hour pilots teaching 250 hour pilots.

"Perimiter 102 clear of the magical zone conflicting traffic it's Perimeter 102 please advise"

[AWOS]

Borek. You'll see and experience way more than you would at Perimeter. The idea that Perimeter captains go to Air Canada is bullshit. Today, they're going to Jazz and Sky Regional just like everyone else.

[Kzanol]

Which ever one calls you!

[arctic_slim]

Well its definitely today's attitude to just want to get as many hours as possible and get captain as quick as possible no matter what. You should be looking at things like:
Which company has a better reputation?
Which one seems safer?
What kind of planes do they fly and where do they fly to?
What type of flying would you rather do more of?
What would you like to do? go on adventures around the world and to the south pole or fly metros around canada?
Which company do you think you'd enjoy flying for more?

When I applied for my first job I didn't care how long the wait was on the ramp or when I would see captain time. I only applied to the companies that I felt were where I wanted to be, the ones that I thought to myself "they seem like a good outfit and I like their planes and their type of flying". If you are with a good company and you enjoy the job, then the rest of the stuff will eventually happen.

The companies will also see if you are genuinely interested in being there or if you're just wanting to be in there for hours. It could make a difference to where they put you and when they put you on it.

That's just my opinions though.

I know a guy at Borek, he's been there for a few years and absolutely loves it, even though hes not captain yet, he loves his job and his life and the adventures he goes on.

[fish4life]

Biggest question, do you want a job your home every night or a job your on rotations ? Perimeter is home every night and Borek tends to all be rotations so that's important to consider. 16 days a month at perimeter not sure what Borek is.

[Axial Flow]

Inuvik, Calgary, Maldives, South Pole or Winnipeg? I pick South Pole.

[P14t00n]

Sadly they dont fly at the maldives anymore, or that would have been an easy choice. Also, do Kenn borek do schedule flights or are they mainly just charter and medevac?

[Mr. North]

P14t00n you have to ask yourself what it is you really want to accomplish? If you had offers from both I'd base my decision on what kind of lifestyle I'd want to have vs what kind of experience I hope to gain. You'll be at either operator for a number of years before moving on so best to choose the one you'd enjoy flying for the most. Granted that can be a tough choice for someone new to the industry so do your homework and ask around.

If you're looking for a stable job and a direct line to the majors, Perimeter is your answer. You'll learn the ins and outs of regional flying from the get go. However once the initial excitement of making it onto the flight line is over, the flying will get repetitive and mundane. It can drive some people nuts. Others couldn't care less, preferring instead to focus on their lives outside of work. Also, despite what many on here think, Winnipeg is a great city for a guy/gal to get their start. The cost of living is cheap and most of the operators here pay well (PAG included). You'll find you can afford a quality of life here that you simply can't get in most other Canadian cities. Want to raise a family and be home most nights? This is your ticket.

If you're looking to see just how far down the rabbit hole a pilot's licence will take you, go for Kenn Borek. The flying here is without a doubt the best around. If you show up with the right work ethic, you'll be rewarded with some of the most amazing experiences this profession can offer. Exploring the High Arctic, Antarctic, and everything in between; wheels, floats (although not lately), tundra tires, and skis.. the challenges are there should you choose to accept them. The pay depends on your performance and ability to negotiate but in general it's good. The schedule sucks and it can be quite difficult to plan your life. But having said that, you do get large blocks of time off (3 week rotations domestically, longer for international work). In the beginning you'll live in Calgary but later you can live in any major city of your choosing. It's a bit of a circus here I'll admit but with that comes a certain amount of freedom that is getting harder and harder to find. So if you're single with nothing tying you down, want to enjoy flying in it's purest form, and have some tall tales to look back upon in the years ahead when you're sitting at FL380, look no further.

[Mr. North]

KBA provides scheduled service at all three of it's northern bases with Inuvik being the busiest.

[GreenBastrd]

I started at Borek. Having never really seen the world these guys packed my ass all over the place in a DC3 to see the world. As a young single guy it worked out well and I had zero regrets. Pay for the most part is a lot better than most entry level operators in our industry, but if home time is high on your priority list Borek might not be your bread and butter. Message me for more info if you want.

[Strobes]

Choose the company where captains stay longer. Right now that appears to be PAG.

[oldtimer]

If I were you, I would bypass the Ops Manager and HR and go directly to the CEO. I would tell him that unless they promise to keep me on the ramp for a maximum of 3 months till I learn the ropes and move me from right seat to left seat in a maximum of 2 years with salary equal to the higher time captains, they may miss out on the oppertunity to hire the greatest pilot that was ever to cross their doorsteps. After all, all you need is a chance to prove your greatness. No need to remenber where the front door is, they will be glad to show you out.
Then go to Borek and try the same.
I would also emphasize I am only there for a short time, at least till I get my A's and be offered a directors position or possibly CEO at AC or Westjet.

[Blueontop]

If I were you, I would bypass the Ops Manager and HR and go directly to the CEO. I would tell him that unless they promise to keep me on the ramp for a maximum of 3 months till I learn the ropes and move me from right seat to left seat in a maximum of 2 years with salary equal to the higher time captains, they may miss out on the oppertunity to hire the greatest pilot that was ever to cross their doorsteps. After all, all you need is a chance to prove your greatness. No need to remenber where the front door is, they will be glad to show you out.
Then go to Borek and try the same.
I would also emphasize I am only there for a short time, at least till I get my A's and be offered a directors position or possibly CEO at AC or Westjet.

Fortune favors the bold!

[switchflicker]

I like the idea. Who's the CEO at PAG nowadays. Still MW?

[Illya Kuryakin]

Every word of advice is worth every cent you paid for it.
Illya