Safety Factors Discussion (Split from the Ganja Thread)

[xsbank]

Seems to me that this thread was about pilots smoking dope. I think that comparing it to other vices or problems is a red herring (or would that be a straw man?) and simply distracts the audience from the question.

Let's have a session discussing the duty day thingy. Wouldn't you say that you should use your discretion and maybe take some days off, STL?

Having said that, I have nothing more to say about marijuana.

[sky's the limit]

Let's have a session discussing the duty day thingy. Wouldn't you say that you should use your discretion and maybe take some days off, STL?

That, xs, is exactly what I do.

I have not worked a 42 in years, I now will do maximum of 28, and preferably 21 with two full weeks off - it's in my contract. This is exactly my point however, as there are MANY pilots who when asked to extend tours willingly do so, stretching the limits of fatigue, marriages, and mental health - all critical factors in the safety of any flight operation, but even more acute when you're talking about the high-stress, isolated, and intense operations that exist in the helicopter industry.

When I flew airplanes, I had no idea what was happening in the rotary industry, but now am intimately familiar with the hazards. The closest thing I experienced in FW was outside of Canada in the ludicrous FAR Part 91 operations where there are no flight and duty times so to speak...

stl

[sky's the limit]

I split this topic off the dope thread because I think it's very important to identify, and educate the pilot pool in this country to some of the very real risks and pitfalls inherent to flying for a living.

I'm hoping for a succinct discussion that will help educate and enlighten us all.

Fire away with your experiences.

stl

[Airtids]

I spent quite a few years as a VFR pilot in some of the most challenging terrain on the planet, all year round. I was the boss, so I got to call the shots, but ocassionally we would come up against a client who knew just enough about aviation to make themselves dangerous. One of these situations was very easy for me to say NO to, but harder to explain. Client wanted to get from CZNL to CYKA and Wx was 1200', 4 miles. They knew, and were right, that the Wx was legal. I knew it was suicide.

A sim instructor I had used the saying "It's a limit, not a target". I think we all need to understand this in day-to-day operations. 14hrs may be a limit, not necessarily a target, for example.

[Nark]

How many of you prepare for your duty day the day/night prior?

I've heard way to many people say, "Well I fly at 8, so I'm good to go until midnight." I'm not talking about getting plastered, but a few beers perhaps.

I'm not a neurologist, however I do know that alcohol reduces the quality of sleep. Ie. you do not reach REM in your sleep cycle.

Lets compound that bad nights sleep into a 14 hour duty day. I've been there and can thank God that the gyro's or fuel pump didn't fail at hour 10 of 14.

Being tired is just as dangerous as being intoxicated.

[xsbank]

I was told to meet an a/c in Anchorage to fly it to California. I live in the east so I took an AC 'Bus to Chicago, ran the mile or two across the terminal, jumped on an Alaska 737 (Had to be moved from the rear bulkhead seat cause it didn't recline), had time to eat a King Crab appetiser in Anchorage, got on the a/c at 01:00 (Customs had confiscated all the catering because the a/c came from Thailand and it was too late to add more) so no real food, flew the rest of the night about 500 miles offshore at the widest - its DARK out there; and landed at about 05:30. Slept in the FBO bunk for about an hour then cabbed it to SFO and AC'd it back to Toronna, then RJ to YUL. Felt like the proverbial dog-turd rolled in sand.

24 hours away from home. How would you measure that duty day?

[THEICEMAN]

I was told to meet an a/c in Anchorage to fly it to California. I live in the east so I took an AC 'Bus to Chicago, ran the mile or two across the terminal, jumped on an Alaska 737 (Had to be moved from the rear bulkhead seat cause it didn't recline), had time to eat a King Crab appetiser in Anchorage, got on the a/c at 01:00 (Customs had confiscated all the catering because the a/c came from Thailand and it was too late to add more) so no real food, flew the rest of the night about 500 miles offshore at the widest - its DARK out there; and landed at about 05:30. Slept in the FBO bunk for about an hour then cabbed it to SFO and AC'd it back to Toronna, then RJ to YUL. Felt like the proverbial dog-turd rolled in sand.

24 hours away from home. How would you measure that duty day?

Now that's rough!

[sky's the limit]

Wouldn't you say that you should use your discretion...?

Right back at ya...


stl