Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

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Colonel Sanders
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Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Colonel Sanders »

http://www.flyingmag.com/news/troubled- ... bob-hoover
the left landing gear was stuck in the wheel well and all normal emergency procedures failed to free it.

After making several calls, Jeanes phoned venerated P-51 pilot Bob Hoover to see if he could offer any advice.

... the aircraft landed safely with gear fully extended
I know the youngsters here don't think much of (or know
much about) Bob Hoover, whom another insignificant pilot
called Jimmy Doolittle referred to as "the best stick and rudder
pilot ever".

And I know plenty of people don't think much of my obsession
with understanding the fundamentals of your aircraft systems,
and of comprehending high school physics.

But Bob did good, even if he wasn't within a thousand miles of
the aircraft.
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Prairie Chicken
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Prairie Chicken »

Bob was always a hell of a pilot, and a prince of a man as well. I met him a couple of times back in his hay day--a nice man.

Good for Bob; damn good for the a/c!
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by ktcanuck »

Colonel Sanders wrote:http://www.flyingmag.com/news/troubled- ... bob-hoover
I know the youngsters here don't think much of (or know
much about) Bob Hoover, whom another insignificant pilot
called Jimmy Doolittle referred to as "the best stick and rudder
pilot ever".

And I know plenty of people don't think much of my obsession
with understanding the fundamentals of your aircraft systems,
and of comprehending high school physics.
.
I know you think you know.
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Changes in Latitudes
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Changes in Latitudes »

Maybe its not the message, but the delivery that people don't want to absorb. If every time I received a letter, the post carrier attached it to a brick and pitched it through my window, I'd start to get sick of receiving mail; no matter how important the message contained may be.
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by pdw »

Colonel Sanders wrote:http://www.flyingmag.com/news/troubled- ... bob-hoover
the left landing gear was stuck in the wheel well and all normal emergency procedures failed to free it.

After making several calls, Jeanes phoned venerated P-51 pilot Bob Hoover to see if he could offer any advice.

... the aircraft landed safely with gear fully extended
... understanding the fundamentals ....
and comprehending ......
'Presence of mind' would be another ... for the museum director to get Bob on the phone in time.
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iflyforpie
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by iflyforpie »

Really? It took Bob Hoover to tell the pilot who was flying a high performance aircraft that pulling some Gs might free the landing gear? Honestly, I wouldn't have wasted one of my lifelines on that one before trying it out myself.
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Geo »

iflyforpie wrote:Really? It took Bob Hoover to tell the pilot who was flying a high performance aircraft that pulling some Gs might free the landing gear? Honestly, I wouldn't have wasted one of my lifelines on that one before trying it out myself.
Fair enough. But on the other hand, he got to chat with Bob Hoover about the finer points of flying a P-51.

g
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Colonel Sanders »

pulling some Gs
Armchair quarterbacks abound. Why don't you
tell us how many G's should he pull in his P-51? For
how long? What rate of change of G would you
recommend? Doing which maneuver? What airspeed
does he need to maintain to safely sustain your
recommended G? What power setting would you
recommend to avoid stall/spin during your recommended
maneuver? What safety concerns does he need to
keep in mind?

Please tell us all about your experience with stall/spin
behaviour in the P-51. Is it something we have to be
worried about during your maneuvers?

I'm waiting.
the delivery that people don't want to absorb
The price of ignorance is death.

How's that for delivery? Too complicated for you? Did
it make you feel bad about yourself?
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by bizjets101 »

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Changes in Latitudes
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Changes in Latitudes »

Colonel Sanders wrote:
pulling some Gs

the delivery that people don't want to absorb
The price of ignorance is death.

How's that for delivery? Too complicated for you? Did
it make you feel bad about yourself?
Nah, we're cool. Not everyone has people skills.
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by GUMPS »

Colonel, ease up. We all know you're perfect :prayer: Please post a picture of you flying just to keep this thread on the downward spiral it's already in.
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Colonel Sanders »

We all know you're perfect
Two blinding obvious points:

1) I ain't perfect

2) This thread isn't about me, but I'm
interested that you're trying to make it so.
Not everyone has people skills
Unfortunately an aircraft rarely gives a sh1t about
what you think, or how you're feeling.

Do you think Curtis LeMay would give a sh1t about
your feelings?
Robert McNamara described LeMay's character, in a discussion of a report into high abort rates in bomber missions during World War II:

One of the commanders was Curtis LeMay—Colonel in command of a B-24 group. He was the finest combat commander of any service I came across in war. But he was extraordinarily belligerent, many thought brutal. He got the report. He issued an order. He said, 'I will be in the lead plane on every mission. Any plane that takes off will go over the target, or the crew will be court-martialed.' The abort rate dropped overnight. Now that's the kind of commander he was
Do you think that Colonel John Boyd - who was responsible
for the F-15, F-16, F-18 and indirectly the A-10 - could
possibly give a sh1t about your feelings?
According to his biographer, Robert Coram, Boyd was also known at different points of his career as "The Mad Major" for the intensity of his passions, as "Genghis John" for his confrontational style of interpersonal discussion
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Shiny Side Up »

Colonel Sanders wrote:
pulling some Gs
Armchair quarterbacks abound. Why don't you
tell us how many G's should he pull in his P-51? For
how long? What rate of change of G would you
recommend? Doing which maneuver? What airspeed
does he need to maintain to safely sustain your
recommended G? What power setting would you
recommend to avoid stall/spin during your recommended
maneuver? What safety concerns does he need to
keep in mind?
I think the point that Pie man was trying to get at is it seems suprising that there would be a pilot flying the thing who wasn't able to figure those things out. I would hate to think that Bob would have to relay all said information above to the pilot. I mean you'd think the pilot himself would be aware of what can be done with the plane and fairly familiar with said characteristics no? After all, every accident's cause can't be "couldn't contact Bob Hoover to rectify problem".

I was a bit disappointed that the article didn't go into more detail on what the manuver specifically was, after all I would have liked to filed away said little tidbits of information. We also don't know how that conversation went either. Maybe it did go indeed like this:

Doug Jeanes: "Hello Bob? we've got a problem."

Bob Hoover: "What is it this time? I was on the can you know."

DJ: "Sorry Bob, but the P-51 is out with a gear leg stuck up and they can't get it down, the pilot is circling we're trying to figure it out."

BH: "Oh for f#ck sakes. Tell the idiot to pull a few Gs, also tell him to go out over the bay while he's at it."

DJ: "Why over the bay?"

BH: "So he doesn't hit someone's house in case he's forgotten how much he can pull and spins it or something stupid."



Its possible you know. :wink:
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iflyforpie
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by iflyforpie »

I think the point that Pie man was trying to get at is it seems suprising that there would be a pilot flying the thing who wasn't able to figure those things out. I would hate to think that Bob would have to relay all said information above to the pilot. I mean you'd think the pilot himself would be aware of what can be done with the plane and fairly familiar with said characteristics no? After all, every accident's cause can't be "couldn't contact Bob Hoover to rectify problem".
That's exactly what I was saying. Surely someone who has been allowed to take the controls of such a priceless masterpiece (and carrying a paying passenger) should be able to take it to the limits of its performance envelope safely if that was what was indeed required to free the gear.

Consultation is one thing, but the thread title says Bob Hoover Prevents Accident.
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Shiny Side Up »

Consultation is one thing, but the thread title says Bob Hoover Prevents Accident.
Yeah, I mean when I read the thread title I was all hoping for a dramatic James Bond style plane to plane transfer of Bob Hoover to take control of the situation, or at the very least a panicked Stewardess rushing into that cabin of an airliner with an "is anyone here a pilot?" and with a twirl of his mustache, Bob gets up and is all "I am Miss!" Where then he proceeds to rush to the cabin and tell the pair of gold bars up front to quit panicking like little girls, punches out the captain takes his seat and saves the day. Also pours some iced tea while he does it...

Say, I've got an idea for a movie...
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Changes in Latitudes »

Colonel Sanders wrote: Unfortunately an aircraft rarely gives a sh1t about
what you think, or how you're feeling.
:smt008 You should charge me for providing access to such wisdom.
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Colonel Sanders »

Note to the armchair quarterbacks whom are
expert P-51 pilots despite knowing nothing
about them: it bleeds airspeed badly when
the G comes on, which frankly sucks. It is
not a very good turning machine, compared
to other aircraft I have flown.

Also, I suspect that the rate of change of G
(dee cubed ess by dee tee cubed) might be
involved, too. The third derivative.


The following shows complete and utter ignorance
of entirely too much of the "warbird scene"
Surely someone who has been allowed to take the
controls of such a priceless masterpiece should be able to take
it to the limits of its performance envelope safely
I nearly peed my pants laughing so hard, when I read that.

The people who fly warbirds are the people who can
afford to fly them. Rarely are they good sticks, which
is why they crash so often.

I will try to explain this with small words.

People only have 24 hours in the day. They need to sleep,
eat, drink, sh1t which is all overhead. So, they only have
so much time awake.

Some people spend all their time earning money. They
get very good at it (wall st, movies, rock stars). However
these people, who have money, are generally horrible
pilots. A guy I know - wall st money - wrecked a P-51
simply by trying to land it twice in one day. Endless sad
tales of woe result from excessive money-to-brains ratio.

Some people spend all their time learning how to fly well.
However, these people have no money and cannot afford
to buy and fly expensive warbirds.

Time for a Venn diagram.

There is a tiny overlap of the two groups - people with
money, and people with piloting skills. They are very very
rare indeed - Kermit Weeks comes to mind. These are
the people who should be flying the warbirds. However,
the club is open to anyone who can write a big cheque.

If you think everyone that flies an expensive warbird
has the skills of Bob Hoover, you really have no knowledge
of how warbirds are operated. The training and mentoring
of the rich guys is probably more important than parts
availability.
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by bmc »

Colonel...you come here, be decent and share your knowledge, experience and insight with us. Why do you choose to start a thread and make it clear you are a wealthy arrogant dick? Not many of us have had the where with all to even climb into the cockpit of a high performance machine. Why belittle us? does it make you fell bigger?
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Colonel Sanders »

Bruce: again, you miss the point entirely. This
thread has nothing to do with me. Please
stop trying to make it so.

The objective is to try to stop the needless destruction
of airframes and engines by educating pilots ... even
if that process sometimes injures their delicate feelings.

This, I have evaluated, is acceptable collateral damage
because the feelings of pilots repair themselves over
time quite economically. Unlike airframes and engines.
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by DowneastGuy »

Colonel, your goal is admirable. Your use of condescension and ridicule to achieve it is not.
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Colonel Sanders »

http://www.pittspecials.com/articles/Confidence.htm

You don't have to read what I write. In fact, I strongly
recommend that you do not.

However, if you read what I write, you will probably learn
something. For free. That is what I would call a "good deal"
from a cost/benefit standpoint.

It amuses me endlessly that people think that the above is
inadequate. In addition to learning something, for free, they
also want "butter stuffed up their @sses", to quote a grumpy
old fighter pilot.

I won't stuff butter up your @ss. Or anyone else's.

A bonus of the above is that you might develop a slighter
thicker skin. This is not unimportant, and will come in handy
down the road, when you encounter very nasty people in
your life that make me look like Mother Theresa.

Question for you: Do you think that the drill sergeant portrayed
by R. Lee Ermy hated those kids? If not, why did he act
the way he did?

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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Shiny Side Up »

I will try to explain this with small words.
You didn't need to, but thanks. Maybe it would be better to say that for myself and the pie man, we are less suprised that such a thing occurs, but rather dismayed that such a thing occurs. I had of course already extrapolated from my own experience with rich guys and airplanes that there was a large possibility that the more expensive the privately owned plane, the worse the pilot, and there was a strong possibility that the most expensive had some of the worst pilots. The point of your thread, No?
If you think everyone that flies an expensive warbird
has the skills of Bob Hoover, you really have no knowledge
of how warbirds are operated.
No, I didn't think that, I was rather trying to exist at least under some illusion that said pilots would be closer to Bob Hoover level than say zero level pilot level. Thanks for dispelling that notion. :wink:
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by JayVee »

I won't stuff butter up your @ss. Or anyone else's.
Prefer going in dry?
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by Colonel Sanders »

No thanks, had enough of that at the Tribunal.
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Re: Bob Hoover Prevents Accident

Post by JayVee »

:lol:
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