Flying Clubs

boogs82 · Post by **boogs82** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 9:31 am

Is there anything in the Barrie/Newmarket/Orillia area? I've done some searching on Google, but maybe I'm using the wrong search terms. So far I've only found Borden Flying Club out of Edenvale and Barrie Flying Club which seems to be for Ultralights at Barrie/Springwater. Since I don't have the funds to buy just yet I'm looking for something to compare between a club and renting from where I was learning.

smokescreen_wshh · Post by **smokescreen_wshh** » Tue Sep 30, 2014 10:03 am

Flying Clubs seem to be non-existent in the GTA and in your area. I was looking for the same, as I need a place to rent after I'm done my PPL.

niss · Post by **niss** » Tue Sep 30, 2014 10:06 am

There is the Borden flying club out of Edenvale, also you can look into purchasing block time off of local owners. And while you may not be able to afford a whole airplane, shares are surprisingly affordable. That's how I did it. I have a 1/2 on a Piper Cherokee.

YYZSaabGuy · Post by **YYZSaabGuy** » Tue Sep 30, 2014 10:12 am

Try here: http://www.bramptonflightcentre.com/com ... ying-club/.

The Brampton Flying Club has been around since 1946, owns and operates its own airport, and runs the Brampton Flight Centre, which provides flight instruction ranging from Recreational to and including an IATPL in conjunction with its college program.

boogs82 · Post by **boogs82** » Mon May 11, 2015 3:25 pm

I'm still looking into options regarding flying. Does anybody have any experience with Borden Flying Club or flying a Cessna 177? Is there much difference between that and the 172? The membership isn't expensive and the wet rates or the aircraft are decent as well. Much cheaper than the schools in the area which are around $160 plus fuel surcharge plus having to do a checkout if you haven't flown in 30 days, etc. The only plus to the schools are that there are more aircraft available. But I don't know how often Borden Flying Club is booked up.

Rookie50 · Post by **Rookie50** » Mon May 11, 2015 4:05 pm

Boogs,

A 177 is a nice easy step from a 172, with a nice bump in speed. Has big doors -- watch those on windy days -- and a 200 hp engine. I thought about one then went with a 182 (one more step up).

I'd take a good look.

Big Pistons Forever · Post by **Big Pistons Forever** » Mon May 11, 2015 4:45 pm

C177 (built 1968) has a 150 hp engine
C177A (built 1969) has a 180 hp engine with a fixed pitch prop
C177B (built 1970 to 1978) has a 180 hp engine with a constant speed prop.

Rookie50 · Post by **Rookie50** » Mon May 11, 2015 4:56 pm

Big Pistons Forever wrote:C177 (built 1968) has a 150 hp engine
C177A (built 1969) has a 180 hp engine with a fixed pitch prop
C177B (built 1970 to 1978) has a 180 hp engine with a constant speed prop.

Am I thinking of the 177 RG then? Sure one of them had a 200 Hp.

Back to school for me, apparently.

boogs82 · Post by **boogs82** » Mon May 11, 2015 5:09 pm

Big Pistons Forever wrote:C177 (built 1968) has a 150 hp engine
C177A (built 1969) has a 180 hp engine with a fixed pitch prop
C177B (built 1970 to 1978) has a 180 hp engine with a constant speed prop.

Borden has the C177B.

iflyforpie · Post by **iflyforpie** » Mon May 11, 2015 5:18 pm

I know of one 200 horse fixed gear 177. It was an original 1968 that had a nose prang (surprise surprise) and was rebuilt with the mount, engine, and cowl of the RG with the nose gear well plated over and the fixed nose gear left in the original position.

But all other 200HP Cardinals are RGs.

The 150HP ones were dogs, slower than a 172 in original configuration.

The good on Cardinals are the room, visibility, ramp apeal, the sporty handling (as far as Cessnas go), and Cessna support and retained value.

The bad is the forward C of G which makes nose prangs easy (just about every straight 177 has one firewall repair), the poor fwd visibility in the flare (also contributing to the problem), the spar going through the roof, and the doors that are easily caught by wind.

PilotDAR · Post by **PilotDAR** » Tue May 12, 2015 7:04 am

Having learned to fly at Brampton in the 1970's and flying in the Barrie/Newmarket/Orillia area ever since, I can state that there has been a severe downturn in the "club" environment. King City, and Maple had excellent club environments, back in the day, but they are long gone.

The need to fly without dependance upon frail well meaning club organizations took many pilots to simply buy their own plane, and do their own thing. The result is a group of pilots who fly their owned plane, and then go home and read AvCanada, rather than look for a club to join. This sadly leaves non owners to fend for themselves to find something to fly. It's just the change as time goes along, and the "information age" is not helping - I can get my fix of aviation chat right here, so no need to go to the flying club on a rainy day to talk airplanes, the way I did at Brampton decades ago...

Posthumane · Post by **Posthumane** » Tue May 12, 2015 9:01 am

Having just flown a 177B for the first time this weekend after owning a 172 for a few years, I can say that the transition was pretty straight forward. One extra nob (prop) to deal with, and the controls feel a bit different, but generally it's a very similar airplane. V speeds were slightly higher than my 172, but they are probably comparable to a later model. Forward visibility was okay, though I ended up landing a bit flatter than I should have as I'm used to having the panel way lower.

PilotDAR, I agree that the information age is killing off flying clubs, or any hobby clubs for that matter. On the other hand, forums like this tend to facilitate getting into airplane partnerships or block time arrangements as well as spontaneous meetups, so the change isn't necessarily all negative. I've learned much more from AvCanada members than I did from going to meetings of the local flying club.

pelmet · Post by **pelmet** » Tue May 12, 2015 9:42 am

I did my first flight on a 177 RG recently. The instructor did want it to be rotated in a similar manner to a jet as it seems to have a more laminar flow wing. Haven't had a chance to fly it again...yet. But it seems like a nice machine.

boogs82 · Post by **boogs82** » Tue May 12, 2015 11:47 pm

That's what makes things difficult. Everybody has busy lives and nobody sticks around the airport to talk shop. I wish I knew everything that was involved in aircraft ownership or finding a partner, or the difference between renting at a FTU or joining a club. But unfortunately for those of us who want to do the research and would love to hook up with someone for flying, there just aren't that many people out there. Not to mention the difficult task of getting passed the "hey how are you" phase. So that leaves us with places like avcanada to do the research. I don't even know of a site other than barnstormers, here or kijiji where I can look at aircraft for sale and the ads on the bulletin boards are near non-existent.

halfmilevis · Post by **halfmilevis** » Wed May 13, 2015 2:16 am

As a low time PPL, I would also be looking to join a group of people for some interesting flights to and from some places as a group! Probably be an awesome way to learn from one another and see some interesting places also!

HMV

slam525i · Post by **slam525i** » Wed May 13, 2015 7:05 am

There's the Buttonville flying club, which is full of great people but it's only a social organization. It doesn't own any aircraft.

FenderManDan · Post by **FenderManDan** » Wed May 13, 2015 4:58 pm

+1 for buttonville
http://buttonvilleflyingclub.com/

Plenty of planes to see and to try if you are not new.
Drop by hangar 15 Wednesday next week around 6:30 pm. We have a meeting.

slam525i · Post by **slam525i** » Thu May 14, 2015 5:18 am

FenderManDan wrote:Drop by hangar 15 Wednesday next week around 6:30 pm. We have a meeting.

That was THIS week, Dan... (As in it was yesterday.)

We also hang-out at the Druxy's at Buttonville on weekend mornings around 9 or 10 am, but a lot of people will be on a group fly-out to DC this weekend.

Bede · Post by **Bede** » Thu May 14, 2015 7:03 am

pelmet wrote:I did my first flight on a 177 RG recently. The instructor did want it to be rotated in a similar manner to a jet as it seems to have a more laminar flow wing. Haven't had a chance to fly it again...yet. But it seems like a nice machine.

How's a jet rotated? Other than not yanking it off.

Taiser · Post by **Taiser** » Thu May 14, 2015 2:22 pm

I've always liked the looks of the 177's. I looked at getting one a few years ago. They seem relatively cheap when they come up for sale, even in the COPA rag. I never understood why though... ? I hear your pain on the flying clubs. Don't have one around here either!

How a city the size of Thunder Bay can't have one stay open, but little Kapuskasing (where I got my PPL) still has one defies logic!!!

boogs82 · Post by **boogs82** » Thu May 14, 2015 9:17 pm

Taiser wrote:I've always liked the looks of the 177's. I looked at getting one a few years ago. They seem relatively cheap when they come up for sale, even in the COPA rag. I never understood why though... ? I hear your pain on the flying clubs. Don't have one around here either! How a city the size of Thunder Bay can't have one stay open, but little Kapuskasing (where I got my PPL) still has one defies logic!!!

Ahhh Kapuskasing. I miss the North.

boogs82 · Post by **boogs82** » Sat May 16, 2015 10:26 am

FenderManDan wrote:+1 for buttonville
http://buttonvilleflyingclub.com/

Plenty of planes to see and to try if you are not new.
Drop by hangar 15 Wednesday next week around 6:30 pm. We have a meeting.

That's the difficult part right now. Getting beyond the "not new" part.

flyinthebug · Post by **flyinthebug** » Sun May 17, 2015 7:04 am

boogs82 wrote:
Taiser wrote:I've always liked the looks of the 177's. I looked at getting one a few years ago. They seem relatively cheap when they come up for sale, even in the COPA rag. I never understood why though... ? I hear your pain on the flying clubs. Don't have one around here either! How a city the size of Thunder Bay can't have one stay open, but little Kapuskasing (where I got my PPL) still has one defies logic!!!
Ahhh Kapuskasing. I miss the North.

You consider Kapuskasing north? Ok.

T Bay had a great flying club for many years. Sadly, I was working there when it finally closed the doors for good in the mid 90s. God knows Mr. Ball did all he could to keep the club going. He went broke and ultimately died pursuing his passion. The last 3 weeks we were open, we ran off a generator that he hauled down to the club to keep the lights on, as we couldn't afford to pay the hydro bill. We all complain that there are no clubs anymore, but when they did exist, they didn't get much support.

If a city the size of YQT (115,000) cant support a club (it was tried 2 more times and lasted a year at best in YQT), I guess that would explain why the majority of them have gone the way of the Dodo bird.

Buy shares in a small plane and you`ll save money vs. renting from an FTU or club anyways. I presume most people have sorted that out, hence the lack of clubs in todays aviation environment. When I started flying in 1984, clubs were found at every other small airport in Canada. Nowadays, as this thread proves, they are few and far between.

Fly safe all.
FTB

kevind · Post by **kevind** » Tue May 19, 2015 8:44 am

I am with a great little flying club. We own 1 plane, club house, hanger, fuel pumps. But the average age is pushing 60. There are not many new pilots and the young ones that do occasionally show up don't stick around. Plane flew 68 hours last year. Cheapest you can get this 180hp 172 is $105/hr wet. The good news is that when ever I want the plane it is there.

boogs82 · Post by **boogs82** » Wed May 20, 2015 6:20 pm

In Central Ontario by chance? lol

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